WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:15.880 Good morning, everybody. 00:00:16.800 --> 00:00:17.960 Happy Easter. 00:00:18.400 --> 00:00:21.120 Does everybody have an outline? 00:00:22.059 --> 00:00:26.160 And if they don't, I'll put them on this chair over here. 00:00:30.000 --> 00:00:39.939 So, thanks for coming to the Bible study this morning. 00:00:41.039 --> 00:00:45.640 Especially with the new format, I know that it's kind of difficult to figure out first and second and in the middle. 00:00:47.019 --> 00:00:49.560 So, we're going to be discussing the resurrection this morning. 00:00:49.560 --> 00:00:51.920 The historicity of the resurrection. 00:00:52.280 --> 00:00:54.920 The historical reliability of the resurrection. 00:00:55.579 --> 00:00:58.320 The theological importance of the resurrection. 00:00:58.320 --> 00:01:05.640 Why we believe what we believe. 00:01:06.359 --> 00:01:13.019 And so, this is going to be eight weeks where different teachers are going to be exploring the resurrection. 00:01:13.799 --> 00:01:15.980 Some will be focused on individual gospel. 00:01:16.400 --> 00:01:19.079 Some will be focused on some of Paul's letters. 00:01:20.359 --> 00:01:24.359 I'm kind of privileged and excited to do the first installment. 00:01:25.159 --> 00:01:26.900 We are going to look at Mark briefly. 00:01:26.900 --> 00:01:29.640 I'm going to cover Mark a little bit. 00:01:30.060 --> 00:01:37.940 But the real focus of my talk is going to be on why do we believe that this is a real historical event. 00:01:38.160 --> 00:01:43.820 And how do we defend that position in the face of so much scrutiny. 00:01:45.420 --> 00:01:47.740 And you're going to get, I mean, the scrutiny is going to come from all angles. 00:01:47.739 --> 00:02:05.619 Just within the world of biblical scholarship, there's probably more antagonistic, sort of anti-resurrection theological scholarship out there than there is to support it. 00:02:05.699 --> 00:02:13.699 I mean, there's people, probably more professors and scholars out there who've made a career out of studying the Bible who don't actually believe the Bible. 00:02:13.699 --> 00:02:17.179 And then there are professors who study the Bible and believe the Bible. 00:02:18.859 --> 00:02:25.859 But if you kind of study, and this has been true in the 19th century and in the 20th century and in the 21st century. 00:02:25.860 --> 00:02:40.560 But what's really cool is that God has faithfully in each of those kind of centuries raised up incredible biblical scholars who have usually one or two voices go into a sea of voices and say, no, wait a minute. 00:02:41.120 --> 00:02:42.020 You don't have this. 00:02:42.120 --> 00:02:43.900 You're not treating this material correctly. 00:02:43.980 --> 00:02:45.760 You're not interpreting this material correctly. 00:02:45.759 --> 00:02:55.799 And this is how we're going to sort of faithfully reconstruct this historical narrative, both and understand the history of it and the theological significance of it. 00:02:56.159 --> 00:02:58.959 So the outline is very in-depth. 00:02:59.479 --> 00:03:04.099 I sat down with Matt and thought about, you know, how am I going to teach this well? 00:03:04.139 --> 00:03:06.340 Because this subject is very complex. 00:03:06.699 --> 00:03:11.359 I brought some of the books that I've read, some of them more than once. 00:03:11.360 --> 00:03:26.440 And the subject of the historicity of the resurrection brings inevitably, brings into it lots of different disciplines, philosophy, archaeology, history, theology, linguistics. 00:03:27.580 --> 00:03:31.420 And you can't really, and I said, okay, well, I'm not going to get into all that. 00:03:31.460 --> 00:03:32.940 I'm going to make this really user-friendly, right? 00:03:33.020 --> 00:03:35.380 So let me, you know, here's some points. 00:03:35.480 --> 00:03:40.580 I'm going to give them these like four or five kind of apologetic points and make it simple. 00:03:40.580 --> 00:03:41.680 And then I started writing out. 00:03:41.740 --> 00:03:43.280 I'm like, I can't really do that. 00:03:43.360 --> 00:03:45.280 I can't simply say, hey, guess what, guys? 00:03:45.320 --> 00:03:47.460 The Gospels are dated early rather than late. 00:03:47.880 --> 00:03:48.820 You know, that's it. 00:03:48.860 --> 00:03:49.560 And let's move on. 00:03:49.700 --> 00:03:51.939 Like, you know, kind of have to talk about that a little bit. 00:03:52.200 --> 00:03:54.720 So that's why there's a lot of information in here. 00:03:54.939 --> 00:03:56.140 I'm going to use it as a guide. 00:03:56.640 --> 00:03:58.100 And obviously you can follow along with it. 00:03:58.200 --> 00:04:05.220 But I'm not going to kind of spend ten minutes on trying to get through each one of these points, you know, in an in-depth way. 00:04:05.640 --> 00:04:08.220 Some of them I'll kind of mention and then skirt over. 00:04:08.219 --> 00:04:10.840 Some of them I'll spend more time on. 00:04:11.319 --> 00:04:16.480 And so the bold areas kind of outline the little subsections that we're going to focus on. 00:04:16.540 --> 00:04:17.459 The first is the resurrection. 00:04:17.899 --> 00:04:19.019 The Gospel is literature. 00:04:19.259 --> 00:04:20.740 The Gospels is a literary form. 00:04:20.959 --> 00:04:22.620 And then the Gospel of Mark itself. 00:04:22.620 --> 00:04:31.720 So then we're going to consider Messiah figures in first century Israel or more broadly the second temple period. 00:04:31.879 --> 00:04:32.860 So it does that. 00:04:33.620 --> 00:04:34.800 You're going to hear me. 00:04:34.840 --> 00:04:36.720 I'm going to kind of give you a little bit of a word key here. 00:04:36.980 --> 00:04:38.079 Second temple period. 00:04:38.319 --> 00:04:41.939 The first temple built by Solomon is destroyed. 00:04:41.939 --> 00:04:43.879 There's an exile. 00:04:44.519 --> 00:04:49.879 And then out of exile, the Israelis come out of exile, build the second temple. 00:04:50.319 --> 00:04:57.399 And so when you talk about the second temple period, you're talking about that time in Israel's history after the second temple was built. 00:04:57.939 --> 00:05:00.980 And sometimes you use interchangeably the first century, the second temple period. 00:05:00.980 --> 00:05:05.560 Obviously the second temple period is longer than just simply 100 years. 00:05:05.879 --> 00:05:16.020 But we're going to look at Messiah figures in that time period and then the nature of oral history and hopefully give you an understanding of what oral histories are. 00:05:16.300 --> 00:05:20.920 And to understand that oral histories are integral and important to biblical history. 00:05:21.500 --> 00:05:23.160 The Bible didn't just appear. 00:05:23.520 --> 00:05:27.540 Like Jesus didn't, you know, was raised from the dead, ascended, and then here's the Bible. 00:05:27.700 --> 00:05:28.879 That, of course, didn't happen. 00:05:28.879 --> 00:05:33.879 Then we're going to look at eyewitness testimony focusing on Richard Baucom. 00:05:34.759 --> 00:05:37.100 There's three scholars I'm going to talk a little about today. 00:05:37.560 --> 00:05:38.779 I think that they're all first rate. 00:05:38.879 --> 00:05:44.579 I think that they're doing some of the best scholarship not only of today but maybe of all time. 00:05:45.399 --> 00:05:50.899 Richard Baucom and eyewitness testimony and how that relates to understanding the resurrection and the historicity of it. 00:05:51.420 --> 00:05:54.279 N.T. Wright, who N.T. Wright really covers everything. 00:05:54.279 --> 00:06:00.719 And then we're Bauckham and then the third scholar kind of have more focused areas of inquiry. 00:06:01.259 --> 00:06:03.819 N.T. Wright just says, I'm going to, you know, I'm going to give you everything. 00:06:04.079 --> 00:06:10.839 And so N.T. Wright, we're going to talk about mutation of core Jewish beliefs after the resurrection. 00:06:11.119 --> 00:06:12.199 How do we explain that? 00:06:12.279 --> 00:06:15.099 What does it have to do with is the resurrection real or not? 00:06:15.100 --> 00:06:20.480 And then finally Larry Hurtado, which is a lesser known scholar but I think it's first rate. 00:06:21.200 --> 00:06:27.760 And his work has to do with high Christology, and I'll get into what that means, and bi-theism. 00:06:28.100 --> 00:06:32.560 So bi-2 as opposed to monotheism-1, bi-theism in early Christianity. 00:06:33.320 --> 00:06:40.300 You're going to hear me say, I'm going to use the term conservative and liberal usually in regard to scholarship. 00:06:40.300 --> 00:06:48.420 Just because as Americans those words are loaded words, but they're catchphrases that I think we understand. 00:06:48.620 --> 00:06:56.500 So when I say liberal scholar, I'm not talking about the person's core beliefs or morality, their political leanings. 00:06:56.720 --> 00:07:03.759 I'm saying that their scholarship is not in line with conservative, orthodox, Christian thought. 00:07:04.300 --> 00:07:07.860 Liberal scholars, by and large, don't believe in miracles. 00:07:07.860 --> 00:07:10.699 Don't believe Jesus was the son of God. Don't believe he was raised from the dead. 00:07:12.540 --> 00:07:16.980 And when I say conservative scholars, I'm meaning scholars who do believe that. 00:07:18.520 --> 00:07:21.220 Just so there's a confusion when I start throwing out liberal this, liberal that. 00:07:21.319 --> 00:07:24.759 I'm not really talking about pop culture and politics and things like that. 00:07:25.480 --> 00:07:35.280 So opening it up with a very famous group of verses from 1 Corinthians, chapter 15, verses 12 through 19. 00:07:35.279 --> 00:07:39.899 I'm not going to spend too much time on this because there will be later lessons where they focus almost exclusively on this verse. 00:07:40.159 --> 00:07:43.739 But I can't think of a better place in the Bible that centers this study. 00:07:44.399 --> 00:07:45.059 And Paul writes, 00:07:45.060 --> 00:07:51.360 Now if Christ is proclaimed as raised from the dead, how can some of you say there is no resurrection of the dead? 00:07:52.759 --> 00:07:56.360 But if there is no resurrection of the dead, then not even Christ has been raised. 00:07:56.720 --> 00:08:01.300 And if Christ has not been raised, then our preaching is in vain and your faith is in vain. 00:08:02.220 --> 00:08:11.379 We are even found to be misrepresenting God because we testified about God that he raised Christ, whom he did not raise, if it is true that the dead are not raised. 00:08:11.379 --> 00:08:17.079 And if Christ has not been raised, your faith is futile and you are still in your sins. 00:08:17.459 --> 00:08:19.959 Then those who have fallen asleep in Christ have perished. 00:08:20.259 --> 00:08:25.860 If in Christ we have no hope, in this life only we are of all people most to be pitied. 00:08:27.939 --> 00:08:34.460 Paul does an excellent job of letting the believer know what the stakes are in regard to the resurrection. 00:08:34.759 --> 00:08:36.440 You really can't say it any better than that. 00:08:37.299 --> 00:08:39.539 This building exists because of the resurrection. 00:08:39.539 --> 00:08:41.339 We're here because of the resurrection. 00:08:41.879 --> 00:08:50.079 Not because of even more than the virgin birth, more than the life of Jesus, more than the early church fathers, more than anything. 00:08:50.679 --> 00:08:56.159 The resurrection is a reason why we are here, gathered together, why this building even exists in the first place. 00:08:56.699 --> 00:08:58.459 It was a different church before. 00:08:58.539 --> 00:08:59.620 It was an evangelical church. 00:09:00.120 --> 00:09:00.899 It has to be. 00:09:01.059 --> 00:09:02.579 Everything hinges on the resurrection. 00:09:02.580 --> 00:09:09.480 If Christ is raised from the dead, then we are who we say we are and we believe who we say we believe in. 00:09:09.780 --> 00:09:14.480 And we're worshiping a God who has condescended to us and saved us. 00:09:14.840 --> 00:09:18.300 And if the resurrection is not real, then we are all wasting our time. 00:09:18.960 --> 00:09:21.660 And Paul goes even further and says people should pity us. 00:09:22.740 --> 00:09:23.780 We've wasted our life. 00:09:23.820 --> 00:09:24.560 We're wasting our time. 00:09:24.820 --> 00:09:25.700 We're wasting our lives. 00:09:25.700 --> 00:09:33.120 We may even be teaching something that is borderline immoral if this isn't true. 00:09:33.580 --> 00:09:43.900 So Paul understands that Jesus is not just somebody who is a really kind man, a wise teacher, sagacious. 00:09:43.899 --> 00:09:50.319 And again, I'm alluding to some of that liberal scholarship now that says, well, it's okay. 00:09:50.980 --> 00:09:52.319 Of course there is no resurrection. 00:09:52.740 --> 00:09:53.519 There are no miracles. 00:09:53.879 --> 00:09:54.579 That's okay. 00:09:54.759 --> 00:09:55.720 I'm still a Christian. 00:09:55.879 --> 00:09:56.840 I still go to a church. 00:09:57.120 --> 00:10:01.179 I think that there's a lot to be gained from studying the man of Jesus. 00:10:01.319 --> 00:10:08.500 There's a lot to be gained with fellowshipping with other people who also look to Jesus, the man, as an example. 00:10:09.319 --> 00:10:11.299 Paul's saying, no, that's baloney. 00:10:11.299 --> 00:10:14.039 No, there isn't anything to be gained from that. 00:10:14.459 --> 00:10:15.500 It doesn't really matter. 00:10:15.699 --> 00:10:20.099 If he has not been raised from the dead, then the whole thing is a sham. 00:10:20.819 --> 00:10:21.859 So those are the stakes. 00:10:22.359 --> 00:10:27.159 And that is hopefully going to frame why it's important for us to understand why do we believe this? 00:10:27.579 --> 00:10:29.359 Why is it historically reliable? 00:10:30.319 --> 00:10:37.159 And then there's a little quote here from, this is a secular historian, not a theologian, 00:10:37.159 --> 00:10:43.159 but is somebody who in his studies of both history and archaeology has come across dealing with the Bible. 00:10:43.500 --> 00:10:48.620 And you'll find that if you start to study these things, the Bible for almost all historians, 00:10:48.799 --> 00:10:53.039 certainly are all archaeologists who go anywhere near the Near East. 00:10:53.039 --> 00:10:56.599 The Bible is a major source for them, believing or not. 00:10:56.699 --> 00:11:01.939 The Bible is viewed as a strong, reliable historical source for all sorts of things. 00:11:02.539 --> 00:11:03.199 And he writes, 00:11:03.200 --> 00:11:22.259 And that is true, whether you're talking about Plato, whether you're talking about Sophocles, Virgil. 00:11:22.259 --> 00:11:28.580 And these are names that in the world, they're never questioned. 00:11:29.120 --> 00:11:33.559 Everyone believes that these people existed, that they wrote what they wrote, that they said what they said. 00:11:34.120 --> 00:11:46.000 And if you were to study this, you would find that the historical evidence for the manuscript support for these individual works and these individuals doesn't come close. 00:11:46.000 --> 00:11:53.039 It doesn't even come into the same league for Jesus, for the Bible, for the resurrection, for so on and so forth. 00:11:53.840 --> 00:11:57.799 So the first section, the resurrection, Gospels of Literature and the Gospel of Mark. 00:11:59.500 --> 00:12:04.179 The Gospels are unique in literary history and represent a completely novel form at the time of their writing. 00:12:04.299 --> 00:12:08.179 So this is, again, something that we should be thinking about. 00:12:08.799 --> 00:12:09.860 Look at ancient history. 00:12:10.220 --> 00:12:11.159 Look at the rest of the Bible. 00:12:12.399 --> 00:12:13.679 Gospels are unique. 00:12:14.139 --> 00:12:15.659 They're different from Paul's letters. 00:12:15.659 --> 00:12:17.339 They're different from anything in the Old Testament. 00:12:18.100 --> 00:12:23.620 And if we ask ourselves, well, why did men sit down to write these? 00:12:24.000 --> 00:12:25.839 What is it that they're trying to tell us? 00:12:25.919 --> 00:12:26.860 How are they written? 00:12:27.379 --> 00:12:30.299 We find that, again, in ancient history, they're unique. 00:12:30.740 --> 00:12:34.500 And they are resurrection narratives. 00:12:35.339 --> 00:12:39.419 So these are men who believe that Jesus was God incarnate. 00:12:39.419 --> 00:12:52.339 Theoretically, if God comes to earth, his birth, his childhood, his adolescence, his adult life, everything should really be of the utmost importance. 00:12:52.340 --> 00:12:56.340 You wouldn't say, God is here, but none of that other stuff matters. 00:12:56.500 --> 00:12:57.680 Only this one thing matters. 00:12:58.259 --> 00:12:59.399 That really wouldn't make sense. 00:12:59.540 --> 00:13:01.379 And yet, that is kind of what the Gospels say. 00:13:01.480 --> 00:13:07.180 They say, no, Jesus was God, but I'm not going to tell you really anything much about his birth, a chapter or so. 00:13:07.740 --> 00:13:10.240 Nothing about his childhood, teenage years. 00:13:11.139 --> 00:13:11.800 We're going to talk. 00:13:11.940 --> 00:13:14.360 There will be a nice chunk about his ministry. 00:13:14.360 --> 00:13:21.379 And then the main event in all four Gospels, which is the three synoptics and John, is the death, the crucifixion, and the resurrection. 00:13:22.340 --> 00:13:23.480 That's not by coincidence. 00:13:24.139 --> 00:13:32.700 That's because the men who are writing these Gospels understood this is Jesus' purpose for coming. 00:13:33.180 --> 00:13:41.720 This is our, now becomes our purpose in proclaiming him as Lord, as following him, as calling others in to follow him, 00:13:41.720 --> 00:13:46.560 to create a community, to create a church, and then to go out into the world and spread that message. 00:13:47.560 --> 00:13:54.379 We're preaching the death and the resurrection of Jesus Christ and not the birth and the life and the childhood. 00:13:54.639 --> 00:13:56.660 Because it all matters because it's all God, right? 00:13:56.700 --> 00:13:59.460 That's not what the Gospels are. 00:14:00.100 --> 00:14:05.920 And it's important for us to take note of that when we're thinking about, is the resurrection important? 00:14:06.139 --> 00:14:08.220 Was it important to the people at that time? 00:14:08.220 --> 00:14:13.360 And certainly it was just look at what they felt they should sit down and write. 00:14:15.980 --> 00:14:18.080 They're both historical and theological documents. 00:14:18.600 --> 00:14:20.920 Focus primarily on the resurrection, as I've just said. 00:14:21.180 --> 00:14:23.139 And they give minimal treatment to other areas of his life. 00:14:24.139 --> 00:14:32.360 The early acceptance of an empty tomb and resurrection is the true catalyst for the unique literary form taking shape over and above the birth and life of Jesus. 00:14:32.360 --> 00:14:37.320 So these aren't, the Gospels are not, some scholars usually say, well, they're historical biographies. 00:14:37.800 --> 00:14:44.500 They're not biographies because they don't care so much about a huge chunk of Jesus' life. 00:14:44.899 --> 00:14:53.360 They are resurrection story, resurrection narrative, resurrection histories, resurrection biographies even. 00:14:53.360 --> 00:14:57.159 And by the way, this is really going to be sort of a lecture format. 00:14:57.360 --> 00:14:58.240 Normally I don't do that. 00:14:58.320 --> 00:15:00.399 I like having back and forth on a lot of questions. 00:15:01.320 --> 00:15:03.500 I really know where to do that and get all this information in. 00:15:04.019 --> 00:15:08.060 But nevertheless, if you say, I have a question about that, I'm confused, raise your hand. 00:15:08.279 --> 00:15:09.080 It's a small enough group. 00:15:10.080 --> 00:15:10.899 That would be fine. 00:15:10.899 --> 00:15:16.899 So accurate dating of the Gospels is paramount in reliable historical Jesus analysis. 00:15:17.279 --> 00:15:24.199 This is one of those areas I didn't want to spend too much time on, and yet I realize you can't really talk about defending the resurrection. 00:15:24.319 --> 00:15:26.379 Somebody says to you, well, how do you believe this stuff? 00:15:26.419 --> 00:15:26.939 How do you believe it? 00:15:27.720 --> 00:15:29.360 Someone was raised from the dead. 00:15:30.199 --> 00:15:37.120 You're going to find, if you purport to give that person an answer, that you're going to start bringing in, well, let's look at what the Bible says. 00:15:37.120 --> 00:15:43.240 You're going to have to grapple with, when was this written, and is that important? 00:15:43.360 --> 00:15:44.279 And the answer is yes. 00:15:44.740 --> 00:15:53.679 So I'm not going to spend too much time on it, but I will tell you that conservative scholarship dates the Gospel of Mark around AD 60. 00:15:54.320 --> 00:15:56.940 We believe that Jesus died somewhere around AD 33. 00:15:57.600 --> 00:15:58.139 So you do the math. 00:15:58.200 --> 00:15:59.419 It's 27 years after his death. 00:15:59.519 --> 00:16:04.519 This is within the lifetime of people who were there, who saw this, who experienced it. 00:16:04.519 --> 00:16:08.379 Matthew and Luke, maybe 15, 20 years later. 00:16:08.519 --> 00:16:10.899 John, maybe much later, AD 90. 00:16:11.139 --> 00:16:14.779 John was, of course, very, very young when the other apostles were older. 00:16:14.779 --> 00:16:24.199 So that is accepted by all of conservative scholarship, and I would say the vast majority of moderate scholarship, too. 00:16:24.740 --> 00:16:38.839 And nowadays, we've gotten so good at dating these things that even liberal scholars will say, okay, you know, that dating may be accurate, but here are all the reasons why I still think that people aren't raised from the dead and things like that. 00:16:38.840 --> 00:16:42.660 So Paul's letters, and we're going to talk a little bit about Paul today. 00:16:43.440 --> 00:16:51.320 Paul's first letter, earliest letter that we can date, 1 Thessalonians, probably AD 50, 51, 52 at the latest. 00:16:51.320 --> 00:16:59.860 So now you're talking, thanks, you're talking 20 years after the death and resurrection of Jesus. 00:17:00.860 --> 00:17:11.259 And what's important, not just is that it happened 20 years after the death and resurrection of Jesus, but that in Paul's letters, we already have established what is called a high Christology. 00:17:11.259 --> 00:17:19.819 A high view and an accepted widespread view of who Jesus was, what he did, that he died, and that he rose again. 00:17:20.599 --> 00:17:27.440 Historians have to account for that early widespread acceptance. 00:17:29.420 --> 00:17:37.759 So, why then is dating the Gospels accurately so important? 00:17:37.759 --> 00:17:44.599 And it comes down to Jewish versus, this is the next bullet point, Jewish versus Hellenistic traditions. 00:17:45.119 --> 00:17:49.240 I'm going to use the word Hellenist, Hellenist or Hellenistic, because that's the correct scholarly term. 00:17:49.400 --> 00:17:52.619 What that is referring to is the Greek culture. 00:17:54.640 --> 00:18:00.920 So, Alexander the Great, the Greek Empire, the first major empire in Western civilization, 00:18:00.920 --> 00:18:08.420 leads into the Roman Empire, the Roman Empire, culturally speaking, politically speaking, is Hellenistic in nature. 00:18:08.640 --> 00:18:10.019 It's not very distinct. 00:18:10.019 --> 00:18:14.880 The Roman Empire and the Greek Empire is not distinct culturally, philosophically. 00:18:15.500 --> 00:18:17.800 They mirror one another very closely. 00:18:18.880 --> 00:18:25.259 Very different, however, from Judaism, from the Jewish way of living and thinking about God, 00:18:25.259 --> 00:18:31.920 and interacting with each other as a community, expectation, life and death, family, festivals, so on and so forth. 00:18:32.039 --> 00:18:37.619 It's radically, Judaism radically different from the Hellenistic world that came to kind of engulf it and surround it. 00:18:38.819 --> 00:18:46.859 So, what liberal scholarship wants to do is say, you know, they start with the presupposition of, 00:18:46.980 --> 00:18:48.279 well, we know the resurrection didn't happen. 00:18:48.740 --> 00:18:51.619 We're all reasonable, rational, well, people aren't raised from the dead. 00:18:51.619 --> 00:18:56.879 So, their starting point is, whether they would say it or not, sometimes this is even on a subconscious level, 00:18:57.139 --> 00:19:00.099 the starting point is, well, he wasn't really raised from the dead. 00:19:01.279 --> 00:19:06.659 So, given that, how do I explain what I'm seeing here? 00:19:06.679 --> 00:19:08.959 Because clearly, these people thought that he did. 00:19:09.039 --> 00:19:10.159 They're speaking as though they did. 00:19:10.219 --> 00:19:10.879 They thought that he did. 00:19:10.919 --> 00:19:11.819 So, how do we explain that? 00:19:13.179 --> 00:19:18.779 So, one of the things that was very popular in the 19th century biblical scholarship 00:19:18.779 --> 00:19:24.399 was this idea that the early church was overwhelmingly Greek. 00:19:25.420 --> 00:19:33.299 That very quickly, after Jesus' death, Paul takes up the mantle of chief evangelist, 00:19:34.220 --> 00:19:39.980 focuses on Asia Minor, modern-day Turkey, and founding, you know, whether it's a church in Ephesus, 00:19:40.139 --> 00:19:41.879 the church in Thessalonica, the church in Corinth, 00:19:42.180 --> 00:19:45.819 that the early church was Greek in culture. 00:19:45.819 --> 00:19:48.679 And what do we find in Greek culture? 00:19:48.819 --> 00:19:54.639 We find things like hero, worship, legend, building. 00:19:55.599 --> 00:19:58.500 This flows right out of earliest Greek mythology. 00:19:59.339 --> 00:20:03.599 And so, in Greek cultures, there is a tradition of an oral history, 00:20:04.079 --> 00:20:09.159 and within that oral history, over time, almost think of it as like an evolutionary process, 00:20:09.539 --> 00:20:14.639 as stories are told and retold, legend is built, hero status is built. 00:20:14.640 --> 00:20:19.980 And so, well, how do we explain this sort of very high Christology, 00:20:20.320 --> 00:20:24.040 and what that means is a high view of Jesus as God and not simply as a man? 00:20:24.320 --> 00:20:25.340 How do we explain that? 00:20:25.620 --> 00:20:28.600 Well, we explain that two ways. 00:20:29.180 --> 00:20:32.320 One, the Gospels were very late. 00:20:33.020 --> 00:20:39.300 We'll say that the Gospels are dated at the earliest 150 to 180 A.D. 00:20:39.299 --> 00:20:42.680 You know, the latest Gospel, maybe 200 A.D. 00:20:42.779 --> 00:20:48.019 Now you're talking about centuries, more than a century removed from any eyewitnesses. 00:20:48.819 --> 00:20:50.460 And not only are they dated at that time, 00:20:50.759 --> 00:20:55.519 the church, the people who were telling each other these stories were culturally Greek. 00:20:55.519 --> 00:21:03.700 So, that's why we have this very, this sort of defined Jesus as God, 00:21:04.019 --> 00:21:08.920 Jesus as legendary, almost hero-like status, very easily explained. 00:21:09.680 --> 00:21:13.940 It took on an evolutionary process, 100, 150 years of storytelling, 00:21:14.420 --> 00:21:17.680 and that's why we get the stories that we do. 00:21:17.680 --> 00:21:22.940 Now, again, that is a book unto itself. 00:21:24.140 --> 00:21:32.080 Suffice it to say, conservative, solid biblical scholarship over many years has slowly eroded that view. 00:21:33.580 --> 00:21:36.519 The most liberal Bible scholars might still hold to that, 00:21:36.799 --> 00:21:40.340 but people who take the field very seriously really no longer do. 00:21:40.339 --> 00:21:45.799 But that is, you know, that sort of spawned a century's worth of biblical scholarship, 00:21:46.459 --> 00:21:48.879 mostly in Europe and Germany. 00:21:49.139 --> 00:21:50.879 If you've ever heard the term form critics, 00:21:51.220 --> 00:21:54.599 this is what they sort of built their theology on. 00:21:55.059 --> 00:21:58.919 And so that's why, for us, if we want to be Christians in the world today, 00:21:58.980 --> 00:22:00.679 we want to say, hey, I hold to the resurrection. 00:22:01.139 --> 00:22:02.079 I think it's real. 00:22:02.240 --> 00:22:03.139 I think it really happened. 00:22:03.220 --> 00:22:03.959 I think it's historical. 00:22:04.619 --> 00:22:09.379 You want to be able to talk a little bit about the stories about the resurrection, 00:22:09.380 --> 00:22:10.980 so the Gospels, but also Paul, 00:22:11.380 --> 00:22:14.240 and why do we think they were written, when they were written, 00:22:14.440 --> 00:22:16.400 and who were they written for. 00:22:17.060 --> 00:22:18.960 And we'll talk a little bit about that later, 00:22:19.080 --> 00:22:23.940 but that the earliest believers, that the early church was predominantly Jewish. 00:22:24.320 --> 00:22:29.940 That early Christianity was a Jewish Christianity as opposed to a Greek Christianity. 00:22:30.220 --> 00:22:32.060 That is an important point to try to remember. 00:22:33.380 --> 00:22:35.900 So let me just talk really briefly about the Gospel of Mark 00:22:35.900 --> 00:22:40.500 so that you do have a little bit of an understanding about our first Gospel. 00:22:41.060 --> 00:22:45.280 So Mark is the earliest Gospel, and as I said, probably A.D. 60 when it was written. 00:22:46.780 --> 00:22:49.280 It's the shortest Gospel, and it's the simplest. 00:22:49.920 --> 00:22:54.080 And by simple, I mean that it is without much literary embellishment. 00:22:54.320 --> 00:22:54.519 Yes? 00:22:54.519 --> 00:22:56.040 I don't really catch. 00:22:56.320 --> 00:22:59.540 You said earlier, early church, the Greek culture. 00:22:59.800 --> 00:23:00.040 Yes. 00:23:00.240 --> 00:23:00.680 Right. 00:23:00.880 --> 00:23:03.560 Now you said earlier, Krishna, the Jewish culture. 00:23:03.559 --> 00:23:04.059 Yes. 00:23:04.759 --> 00:23:10.000 So if you can recall in Paul's letters, there's an axe. 00:23:10.500 --> 00:23:12.200 Paul has some interactions with Peter, 00:23:12.779 --> 00:23:20.740 where Peter was wanting to go minister with Greek Christian believers 00:23:20.740 --> 00:23:21.980 who were culturally Greek, 00:23:22.159 --> 00:23:24.819 and then he caught some flack from the Jewish believers. 00:23:25.359 --> 00:23:27.279 There was battles over circumcision. 00:23:27.599 --> 00:23:28.899 Paul talks about Peter, deals with that. 00:23:28.980 --> 00:23:30.220 Paul talks about that in Galatians. 00:23:30.220 --> 00:23:36.079 So the earliest church was a mix, well, the early church was a mix of Jewish believers 00:23:36.079 --> 00:23:39.140 and Greek believers, meaning culturally. 00:23:39.519 --> 00:23:41.839 Culturally Jewish, culturally Greek. 00:23:42.059 --> 00:23:44.460 How they were raised, their cultural norms, 00:23:45.299 --> 00:23:47.839 the way that they ate meals together, 00:23:47.980 --> 00:23:50.339 the way that they related to their elders. 00:23:51.200 --> 00:23:51.720 Different. 00:23:52.180 --> 00:23:52.559 Different. 00:23:52.559 --> 00:23:59.519 And what the good, solid, conservative scholarship has found, 00:23:59.599 --> 00:24:01.700 and this is going to be mostly Hurtado's work, 00:24:02.119 --> 00:24:05.720 is that the earliest church, that first generation of believers, 00:24:06.299 --> 00:24:10.139 was almost exclusively Jewish in culture. 00:24:10.659 --> 00:24:12.259 And this is going to be hugely important. 00:24:12.259 --> 00:24:16.740 That is going to kind of feed into all the different apologetics, if you will, 00:24:16.759 --> 00:24:18.440 that we talk about in defending the resurrection. 00:24:18.819 --> 00:24:24.119 Because the way in which kind of liberal scholarship is able to stifle this belief 00:24:24.119 --> 00:24:25.259 in a real resurrection, 00:24:25.819 --> 00:24:27.279 it all begins with, 00:24:27.720 --> 00:24:31.980 it all hinges on having earliest Christianity be a Greek, 00:24:32.579 --> 00:24:34.319 culturally Greek Christianity. 00:24:34.319 --> 00:24:37.099 They sort of need that to be true, 00:24:37.480 --> 00:24:43.460 in order for their hypotheses as to why people said all this stuff to be true. 00:24:43.779 --> 00:24:44.559 Do you understand? 00:24:45.000 --> 00:24:45.480 Good. 00:24:46.559 --> 00:24:46.819 Yes. 00:24:47.379 --> 00:24:48.039 There's a comment. 00:24:48.179 --> 00:24:50.039 You talked about Jesus' life and how, 00:24:50.460 --> 00:24:52.379 I mean, the crux of his resurrection, 00:24:53.000 --> 00:24:55.539 that he raised people from the dead in public, 00:24:55.700 --> 00:24:56.740 like Lazarus. 00:24:56.859 --> 00:24:57.119 Yes. 00:24:57.500 --> 00:24:58.259 It was public. 00:24:58.639 --> 00:24:58.859 Yes. 00:24:58.939 --> 00:25:00.500 He went in and raised a little girl. 00:25:00.819 --> 00:25:01.059 Yes. 00:25:01.059 --> 00:25:04.339 So he already proved that he could conquer death. 00:25:05.339 --> 00:25:05.960 You know, of course, 00:25:06.079 --> 00:25:07.819 the disciples didn't get it and all that, 00:25:07.940 --> 00:25:10.200 but he constantly said, 00:25:10.299 --> 00:25:11.179 who do you say I am? 00:25:11.519 --> 00:25:13.399 Jews want to stone him because he said, 00:25:13.519 --> 00:25:14.099 I am. 00:25:14.619 --> 00:25:16.220 Just like Moses said, 00:25:16.299 --> 00:25:17.279 who sent me? 00:25:17.539 --> 00:25:18.500 Who should I say sent me? 00:25:19.220 --> 00:25:19.839 I am. 00:25:20.019 --> 00:25:22.519 It was a word they couldn't even say. 00:25:22.679 --> 00:25:23.000 Right. 00:25:23.419 --> 00:25:27.200 And he's proclaiming all this time to be God. 00:25:27.379 --> 00:25:27.679 Yes. 00:25:27.819 --> 00:25:28.539 And who do you say? 00:25:28.599 --> 00:25:29.659 Asking them questions. 00:25:30.159 --> 00:25:30.299 Right. 00:25:30.299 --> 00:25:31.019 So to me, 00:25:31.740 --> 00:25:36.839 for him to do these things was setting up for some to believe. 00:25:36.940 --> 00:25:37.180 Yes. 00:25:37.700 --> 00:25:37.940 Of course, 00:25:37.940 --> 00:25:40.159 they still doubted because it was such a mammoth thing. 00:25:40.299 --> 00:25:40.599 Correct. 00:25:41.279 --> 00:25:42.440 And you're right. 00:25:42.720 --> 00:25:44.279 But what we're discussing right now is, 00:25:44.419 --> 00:25:47.720 so it's not the validity of those individual stories. 00:25:48.399 --> 00:25:50.240 It's the story itself. 00:25:50.599 --> 00:25:52.019 When was that story told? 00:25:52.579 --> 00:25:55.299 Somebody had to tell the story about Lazarus. 00:25:55.379 --> 00:25:55.899 It wasn't written. 00:25:55.900 --> 00:25:56.100 Again, 00:25:56.100 --> 00:25:57.320 we don't have a written, 00:25:57.880 --> 00:26:04.680 either a letter from Paul or a part of a gospel from AD 34 or AD 35. 00:26:05.519 --> 00:26:06.120 Like I said, 00:26:06.200 --> 00:26:07.840 Paul's earliest gospel is maybe 50, 00:26:07.920 --> 00:26:08.180 51, 00:26:08.259 --> 00:26:08.580 52. 00:26:08.700 --> 00:26:09.600 The earliest gospel is 60. 00:26:09.599 --> 00:26:12.959 So what was going on with that story about Lazarus for 20 years? 00:26:13.099 --> 00:26:15.259 That's what scholars are trying to figure out. 00:26:16.259 --> 00:26:16.659 That's, 00:26:16.659 --> 00:26:18.119 that's kind of what we're talking about. 00:26:18.319 --> 00:26:18.659 Somebody, 00:26:19.079 --> 00:26:21.619 people had to orally say, 00:26:21.919 --> 00:26:23.119 let me tell you a little bit about Jesus. 00:26:23.579 --> 00:26:25.240 Do you know that he raised a man from the dead once, 00:26:25.319 --> 00:26:25.679 Lazarus, 00:26:25.740 --> 00:26:26.379 so on and so forth. 00:26:26.380 --> 00:26:27.120 That story, 00:26:27.380 --> 00:26:28.560 before it was ever written down, 00:26:28.840 --> 00:26:30.620 was told and told and told and told. 00:26:30.620 --> 00:26:31.220 So like Romans, 00:26:31.480 --> 00:26:32.100 Paul said, 00:26:32.680 --> 00:26:33.500 maybe the writing, 00:26:33.820 --> 00:26:35.640 he didn't write, 00:26:35.740 --> 00:26:36.400 he had something else, 00:26:36.480 --> 00:26:36.640 right? 00:26:36.800 --> 00:26:38.720 So a lot of those were written down. 00:26:38.900 --> 00:26:39.200 Correct. 00:26:39.280 --> 00:26:39.940 Later on. 00:26:40.140 --> 00:26:40.480 Correct. 00:26:40.940 --> 00:26:41.140 Correct. 00:26:41.280 --> 00:26:42.320 And what we'll find with, 00:26:42.720 --> 00:26:43.220 even within, 00:26:43.260 --> 00:26:43.520 within, 00:26:43.580 --> 00:26:43.820 within, 00:26:44.180 --> 00:26:45.260 so the whole gospel of Mark, 00:26:45.340 --> 00:26:46.080 and we're about to get, 00:26:46.180 --> 00:26:46.400 yet he. 00:26:47.780 --> 00:26:48.120 Well, 00:26:48.160 --> 00:26:48.240 no, 00:26:48.260 --> 00:26:49.660 we don't have an original manuscript, 00:26:49.840 --> 00:26:50.140 so we do, 00:26:50.240 --> 00:26:50.600 there is, 00:26:50.960 --> 00:26:51.120 anyway. 00:26:52.520 --> 00:26:52.780 We'll get, 00:26:52.800 --> 00:26:53.400 we'll get to it. 00:26:53.400 --> 00:26:56.440 So Mark's gospel is simple. 00:26:56.560 --> 00:26:59.440 It's without a lot of literary embellishment. 00:26:59.580 --> 00:27:00.920 I'm not going to take the time to kind of show you, 00:27:00.980 --> 00:27:02.000 because I don't have the time to do it, 00:27:02.180 --> 00:27:05.240 but if I pulled up a section of Mark, 00:27:05.300 --> 00:27:06.040 any section of Mark, 00:27:06.120 --> 00:27:07.160 not just the resurrection narrative, 00:27:07.259 --> 00:27:08.019 any section of Mark, 00:27:08.300 --> 00:27:08.660 compared to, 00:27:08.759 --> 00:27:08.880 say, 00:27:08.900 --> 00:27:11.019 a section of Luke or John, 00:27:11.400 --> 00:27:12.500 there's a lot more information, 00:27:12.680 --> 00:27:13.680 Luke and John. 00:27:14.060 --> 00:27:14.560 Mark is, 00:27:14.560 --> 00:27:16.480 it's sort of a very rapid sort of a pace. 00:27:16.800 --> 00:27:17.460 Jesus showed up, 00:27:17.620 --> 00:27:18.300 Jesus said this, 00:27:18.720 --> 00:27:19.500 and then Jesus left. 00:27:20.080 --> 00:27:20.680 Where in John, 00:27:20.680 --> 00:27:21.220 you might find, 00:27:21.340 --> 00:27:21.920 Jesus showed up, 00:27:21.980 --> 00:27:22.600 and he said this, 00:27:22.599 --> 00:27:24.419 because people were thinking this at the time. 00:27:24.819 --> 00:27:25.139 And so, 00:27:25.219 --> 00:27:25.779 when somebody said, 00:27:25.980 --> 00:27:27.219 and then Jesus responded, 00:27:27.379 --> 00:27:28.599 Jesus responded in that way. 00:27:28.899 --> 00:27:30.079 We don't find that in Mark. 00:27:30.859 --> 00:27:31.219 And, 00:27:31.459 --> 00:27:32.379 well, 00:27:32.399 --> 00:27:33.000 let me read a little bit. 00:27:33.279 --> 00:27:34.000 Mark's simplicity 00:27:34.000 --> 00:27:37.879 aligns easily with an accurate historical retelling, 00:27:38.159 --> 00:27:40.939 and goes against a Hellenistic tradition of hero worship, 00:27:41.299 --> 00:27:43.779 in which fantastical embellishments were commonplace. 00:27:44.480 --> 00:27:45.240 I have a little note here, 00:27:45.279 --> 00:27:47.240 see the apocryphal Gnostic text, 00:27:48.019 --> 00:27:48.779 Gospel of Peter, 00:27:48.879 --> 00:27:49.480 Gospel of Thomas. 00:27:49.480 --> 00:27:52.059 Don't have time to really get into what that means, 00:27:52.200 --> 00:27:52.900 apocryphal Gnostic. 00:27:53.339 --> 00:27:55.099 Know that there were other Gospels, 00:27:55.180 --> 00:27:55.799 other than Matthew, 00:27:55.920 --> 00:27:56.079 Mark, 00:27:56.160 --> 00:27:56.279 Luke, 00:27:56.279 --> 00:27:56.700 and John. 00:27:57.079 --> 00:27:57.680 They existed. 00:27:58.019 --> 00:27:59.200 They were written much later. 00:27:59.519 --> 00:28:00.779 We can't accurately date them. 00:28:01.160 --> 00:28:04.360 They were not written in and around either Rome or the Near East. 00:28:04.740 --> 00:28:05.019 Almost, 00:28:05.400 --> 00:28:07.319 most of them were written in Egypt. 00:28:08.059 --> 00:28:09.259 They were written late. 00:28:09.259 --> 00:28:11.400 And they have what, 00:28:11.720 --> 00:28:13.680 so we were talking about these liberal scholars, 00:28:14.039 --> 00:28:21.599 they have the characteristics that the liberal scholars are so hard to try to find in the canonical Gospels. 00:28:21.839 --> 00:28:27.879 They have overwhelmingly Greek look and feel and sound to them. 00:28:27.880 --> 00:28:28.620 And if you, 00:28:28.760 --> 00:28:31.280 so if you took the time to look at the Gospel of Peter, 00:28:31.380 --> 00:28:32.240 look at the Gospel of Thomas, 00:28:32.760 --> 00:28:33.000 you would, 00:28:33.180 --> 00:28:36.100 they don't sound or look or feel anything like our Gospels. 00:28:38.340 --> 00:28:39.540 And so Mark, 00:28:39.860 --> 00:28:40.980 even more than the other Gospels, 00:28:41.100 --> 00:28:44.480 is the sort of polar opposite of that. 00:28:44.480 --> 00:28:48.680 So Mark's Gospel is based on the testimony of Peter. 00:28:49.059 --> 00:28:49.380 Again, 00:28:49.500 --> 00:28:54.500 an important point that you want to kind of have at the ready to understand. 00:28:55.480 --> 00:28:56.440 That Peter, 00:28:57.140 --> 00:28:58.140 obviously, 00:28:58.480 --> 00:29:03.000 was arguably Jesus' closest confidant, 00:29:03.160 --> 00:29:06.039 with the exception of maybe one or two other of his apostles. 00:29:06.640 --> 00:29:08.579 He traveled with Jesus throughout the whole ministry. 00:29:08.759 --> 00:29:09.599 He was there for everything. 00:29:09.700 --> 00:29:10.420 He saw everything. 00:29:10.640 --> 00:29:12.200 And he traveled with John Mark. 00:29:12.200 --> 00:29:14.519 He told John Mark, 00:29:14.620 --> 00:29:14.840 again, 00:29:15.420 --> 00:29:16.680 what's going on during this 17, 00:29:16.779 --> 00:29:18.279 20 year period before anything was written down. 00:29:18.660 --> 00:29:29.039 Peter is going out and preaching and building up the church and teaching people these stories and telling his closest supporters and people that are with him, 00:29:29.259 --> 00:29:30.180 John Mark being one of them, 00:29:30.660 --> 00:29:32.759 this Gospel story, 00:29:32.880 --> 00:29:34.059 this story of Jesus. 00:29:36.019 --> 00:29:36.519 And so this, 00:29:36.940 --> 00:29:41.940 and scholars believe that this helps explain Mark's sort of seemingly non-chronological, 00:29:42.200 --> 00:29:42.960 structural structure. 00:29:43.660 --> 00:29:43.960 Certain, 00:29:44.299 --> 00:29:49.100 like Luke's Gospel has a very sort of a set structure to it that follows a solid chronological pattern. 00:29:49.559 --> 00:29:51.100 Mark's doesn't seem to do that. 00:29:51.460 --> 00:29:54.180 Scholars feel that is congruent with, 00:29:54.600 --> 00:29:55.039 rather than, 00:29:55.120 --> 00:29:56.180 so Mark didn't see it himself. 00:29:56.299 --> 00:29:58.860 He's not coming into it with his own memories and saying, 00:29:58.920 --> 00:30:00.360 I remember exactly how this played out. 00:30:00.580 --> 00:30:05.340 He is recounting Peter's story and the way that Peter gave it to him. 00:30:05.740 --> 00:30:06.119 Again, 00:30:06.199 --> 00:30:07.759 this is their hypothesis. 00:30:09.459 --> 00:30:14.579 And that's sort of one of the strongest pieces of evidence for both the authorship of Mark. 00:30:14.679 --> 00:30:17.279 Mark really did write the Gospel of Mark and not someone else. 00:30:17.779 --> 00:30:18.119 Again, 00:30:18.240 --> 00:30:19.619 don't have too much time to get into it, 00:30:19.639 --> 00:30:20.899 but that's another whole field of saying, 00:30:21.000 --> 00:30:21.139 well, 00:30:21.339 --> 00:30:21.659 they didn't, 00:30:21.919 --> 00:30:22.759 Mark didn't write Mark. 00:30:23.119 --> 00:30:24.059 Matthew didn't write Matthew. 00:30:24.480 --> 00:30:24.619 They were, 00:30:25.159 --> 00:30:25.919 you know, 00:30:25.959 --> 00:30:27.259 scholars to focus just on that. 00:30:27.259 --> 00:30:29.839 Papias of Hierapolis, 00:30:29.960 --> 00:30:30.940 early church father, 00:30:31.119 --> 00:30:32.079 Bishop of Hierapolis, 00:30:33.079 --> 00:30:33.859 8060, 00:30:34.200 --> 00:30:35.799 it was lifespan 8060 to 130. 00:30:36.059 --> 00:30:36.200 So, 00:30:36.539 --> 00:30:37.480 as a young man, 00:30:38.259 --> 00:30:40.039 Papias would know, 00:30:40.180 --> 00:30:42.500 have been in contact with people who, 00:30:42.619 --> 00:30:43.579 when they were very young, 00:30:44.259 --> 00:30:45.960 either maybe saw Jesus himself, 00:30:46.079 --> 00:30:48.319 or certainly interacted with people who traveled with Jesus. 00:30:48.799 --> 00:30:49.019 So, 00:30:49.119 --> 00:30:52.960 we say that Papias is one generation removed from eyewitness testimony. 00:30:54.379 --> 00:30:56.920 Papias of Hierapolis confirms both the authorship of Mark, 00:30:56.920 --> 00:30:57.860 that Mark wrote Mark, 00:30:58.120 --> 00:31:01.519 and his using of Peter's testimony as the foundation of his Gospel. 00:31:02.180 --> 00:31:02.279 And, 00:31:02.360 --> 00:31:02.620 um, 00:31:02.720 --> 00:31:04.560 the ancient historian Eusebius writes, 00:31:04.759 --> 00:31:05.060 uh, 00:31:05.120 --> 00:31:05.519 this, 00:31:05.720 --> 00:31:06.620 and the elder, 00:31:06.800 --> 00:31:07.680 who he believed to be John, 00:31:08.039 --> 00:31:08.660 the elder, 00:31:08.880 --> 00:31:09.720 John said this, 00:31:09.840 --> 00:31:11.500 Mark became an interpreter of Peter. 00:31:11.800 --> 00:31:13.200 As many things as he remembered, 00:31:13.279 --> 00:31:14.320 he wrote down accurately, 00:31:14.840 --> 00:31:15.940 most certainly not in order. 00:31:16.480 --> 00:31:18.200 The things said or done by the Lord, 00:31:18.440 --> 00:31:20.600 for he neither heard the Lord nor followed him, 00:31:20.800 --> 00:31:21.660 but he came later, 00:31:21.740 --> 00:31:22.320 as he said, 00:31:22.420 --> 00:31:24.820 with reference to Peter who taught whenever the need arose. 00:31:24.820 --> 00:31:26.900 But he did not teach according to the, 00:31:26.920 --> 00:31:28.360 arrangement of the oracles of the Lord, 00:31:28.480 --> 00:31:29.920 with the result that Mark did not err, 00:31:30.380 --> 00:31:32.960 when he thus wrote certain things as he recalled them. 00:31:33.160 --> 00:31:34.920 For he planned out one goal ahead of time, 00:31:35.340 --> 00:31:37.300 namely to leave out nothing which he heard, 00:31:37.680 --> 00:31:39.740 and not to falsify any of the words of Peter. 00:31:39.740 --> 00:31:41.140 So, 00:31:41.140 --> 00:31:42.640 why do we think, 00:31:42.740 --> 00:31:42.920 you know, 00:31:42.940 --> 00:31:43.319 why do we say, 00:31:43.400 --> 00:31:43.480 okay, 00:31:43.559 --> 00:31:48.200 we have a sort of a reliable reason to believe that Mark was written by Mark, 00:31:48.240 --> 00:31:48.740 and that Mark, 00:31:48.900 --> 00:31:49.440 uh, 00:31:49.440 --> 00:31:50.339 is Peter's Gospel? 00:31:50.700 --> 00:31:54.759 This would be one solid piece of evidence for why we say that. 00:31:58.200 --> 00:31:58.559 So, 00:31:58.920 --> 00:32:01.240 I want to transition out of Mark for a minute, 00:32:01.480 --> 00:32:02.120 out of sort of the, 00:32:02.120 --> 00:32:04.400 the introductory kind of remarks. 00:32:04.660 --> 00:32:06.480 Talk a little bit about Messiah figures in the first century, 00:32:06.480 --> 00:32:07.519 because this is an important, 00:32:07.640 --> 00:32:07.799 again, 00:32:07.860 --> 00:32:10.799 an important piece of the apologetic puzzle that we're building. 00:32:11.400 --> 00:32:14.099 The point of this class is really to get you to walk away today saying, 00:32:14.519 --> 00:32:17.019 I can go into a conversation with somebody who says, 00:32:17.640 --> 00:32:18.839 the resurrection is bunk, 00:32:19.259 --> 00:32:21.700 and hopefully have a couple things to say. 00:32:21.900 --> 00:32:22.039 I mean, 00:32:22.059 --> 00:32:22.319 obviously, 00:32:22.640 --> 00:32:23.660 there's a lot here. 00:32:24.160 --> 00:32:24.660 I've spent, 00:32:24.740 --> 00:32:24.920 you know, 00:32:24.980 --> 00:32:26.440 10 years studying this stuff, 00:32:26.519 --> 00:32:28.200 and I'm really only just scratching the surface. 00:32:28.480 --> 00:32:29.059 But still, 00:32:29.140 --> 00:32:30.660 I do think that we can accomplish this morning, 00:32:31.059 --> 00:32:33.319 having a couple solid bullet points to say, 00:32:33.400 --> 00:32:33.900 here's a couple, 00:32:33.900 --> 00:32:34.940 here's some food for thought. 00:32:35.040 --> 00:32:36.080 Here's some things to think about, 00:32:36.240 --> 00:32:37.720 why we believe what we believe. 00:32:38.060 --> 00:32:38.300 And so, 00:32:39.320 --> 00:32:42.019 understanding that Jesus was not the first Messiah figure, 00:32:42.420 --> 00:32:43.780 during the second temple period, 00:32:44.160 --> 00:32:44.740 very important. 00:32:46.980 --> 00:32:47.420 So, 00:32:47.460 --> 00:32:48.759 the first stories of Jesus transmitted, 00:32:48.880 --> 00:32:49.420 committed to memory, 00:32:49.519 --> 00:32:50.620 were oral histories. 00:32:51.400 --> 00:32:54.500 Jesus was spoken about by the apostles, 00:32:54.780 --> 00:32:55.820 by the early church, 00:32:56.300 --> 00:32:56.740 orally, 00:32:57.060 --> 00:32:58.600 long before anything was written down. 00:33:00.300 --> 00:33:01.560 AD 33 to 50, 00:33:01.660 --> 00:33:03.060 so Jesus' death to about AD 50, 00:33:03.059 --> 00:33:04.980 the church of Jesus is thriving, 00:33:05.279 --> 00:33:05.899 in Jerusalem, 00:33:06.139 --> 00:33:07.359 and then surrounding territories, 00:33:07.759 --> 00:33:08.399 into Samaria, 00:33:08.539 --> 00:33:09.940 eventually spreading to Asia Minor, 00:33:10.059 --> 00:33:11.079 which is modern-day Turkey, 00:33:11.379 --> 00:33:12.740 and even Europe later, 00:33:12.919 --> 00:33:13.679 parts of Italy, 00:33:13.919 --> 00:33:14.240 Spain, 00:33:14.539 --> 00:33:15.000 the islands, 00:33:15.099 --> 00:33:15.579 and the Mediterranean. 00:33:16.319 --> 00:33:16.579 However, 00:33:16.659 --> 00:33:17.299 the first canonical, 00:33:17.599 --> 00:33:18.399 written words about Jesus, 00:33:18.500 --> 00:33:19.259 and I already covered this, 00:33:20.460 --> 00:33:22.119 arrived with Paul in his letter to the Thessalonians, 00:33:22.200 --> 00:33:22.919 probably AD 50, 00:33:23.139 --> 00:33:23.779 in the Gospel of Mark, 00:33:23.839 --> 00:33:24.339 and AD 60. 00:33:25.099 --> 00:33:27.759 A majority of ancient historians, 00:33:27.980 --> 00:33:28.720 liberal historians, 00:33:28.819 --> 00:33:31.159 agree that cultures featuring orally transmitted history, 00:33:31.160 --> 00:33:32.600 are ripe settings for slow, 00:33:32.759 --> 00:33:34.380 gradual changes to those oral histories, 00:33:34.800 --> 00:33:36.560 often allowing for hero legend traditions, 00:33:36.700 --> 00:33:38.040 to be established and perpetuated. 00:33:38.440 --> 00:33:39.740 Different stories about Jesus are told, 00:33:39.800 --> 00:33:40.480 and retold so much, 00:33:40.540 --> 00:33:40.960 that eventually, 00:33:41.180 --> 00:33:43.440 each individual story begins to fall into a distinct form. 00:33:43.840 --> 00:33:44.100 Again, 00:33:44.140 --> 00:33:45.160 just sort of rehashing a little bit, 00:33:45.240 --> 00:33:45.960 of what I already covered. 00:33:47.460 --> 00:33:47.900 And again, 00:33:48.000 --> 00:33:49.840 that process is dependent on time. 00:33:50.420 --> 00:33:51.420 They need the Gospels to be, 00:33:51.480 --> 00:33:54.759 you need a late date for Paul's letters, 00:33:54.900 --> 00:33:55.480 for the Gospels, 00:33:55.480 --> 00:33:58.059 to explain that. 00:33:59.559 --> 00:34:01.339 Jesus was not the first Messianic figure, 00:34:01.400 --> 00:34:03.039 recognized in first century, 00:34:03.259 --> 00:34:04.339 second temple Jewish history. 00:34:05.059 --> 00:34:05.519 Judas, 00:34:05.680 --> 00:34:06.460 son of Hezekiah, 00:34:06.640 --> 00:34:07.319 4 BC, 00:34:08.219 --> 00:34:10.159 led an insurrection against Roman authority. 00:34:10.500 --> 00:34:12.079 He was heralded as a Messiah, 00:34:12.460 --> 00:34:12.780 meaning, 00:34:13.340 --> 00:34:15.659 the Israelites saw him as, 00:34:16.199 --> 00:34:19.219 the figure that they had been waiting for, 00:34:19.900 --> 00:34:20.099 that, 00:34:20.579 --> 00:34:21.099 and again, 00:34:21.159 --> 00:34:21.719 this is a, 00:34:21.719 --> 00:34:23.280 sort of a discipline unto itself, 00:34:23.280 --> 00:34:25.680 but studying the hopes and expectations, 00:34:25.680 --> 00:34:26.660 of the Jewish people, 00:34:26.760 --> 00:34:27.700 after the exile. 00:34:28.080 --> 00:34:29.100 They leave Babylon, 00:34:29.600 --> 00:34:30.660 they come back to Israel, 00:34:30.880 --> 00:34:31.980 they build the temple, 00:34:32.140 --> 00:34:33.400 and now they're sort of waiting. 00:34:34.060 --> 00:34:35.760 They're in this mode of waiting, 00:34:35.860 --> 00:34:37.200 they're waiting for a Messiah to come, 00:34:37.280 --> 00:34:38.560 they're waiting for someone to come, 00:34:38.600 --> 00:34:40.320 and put down Roman rule, 00:34:40.420 --> 00:34:41.600 for God to be exalted. 00:34:41.960 --> 00:34:42.960 And it's in this waiting, 00:34:43.260 --> 00:34:44.460 and it's in this expectation, 00:34:44.840 --> 00:34:46.760 that some other figures arose, 00:34:47.000 --> 00:34:47.440 and they said, 00:34:47.519 --> 00:34:47.660 you know, 00:34:47.700 --> 00:34:49.500 maybe this is the person we've been waiting for. 00:34:50.240 --> 00:34:52.400 And Judas was the first, 00:34:52.400 --> 00:34:53.200 John the Baptist, 00:34:53.600 --> 00:34:54.180 a lot of people think, 00:34:54.220 --> 00:34:54.820 what are we talking about? 00:34:54.820 --> 00:34:55.280 John the Baptist, 00:34:55.380 --> 00:34:56.000 he's sort of like, 00:34:56.500 --> 00:34:57.240 pals with Jesus. 00:34:57.800 --> 00:34:58.500 This is not, 00:34:59.060 --> 00:35:01.220 it's something we're thinking about, 00:35:01.280 --> 00:35:02.400 because it doesn't jump right off the page. 00:35:02.800 --> 00:35:04.180 But John and Jesus are, 00:35:04.360 --> 00:35:05.140 there's a connection, 00:35:05.260 --> 00:35:06.500 when they're in the womb together, 00:35:07.160 --> 00:35:08.060 Jesus comes to John, 00:35:08.100 --> 00:35:08.600 and is baptized. 00:35:09.300 --> 00:35:10.640 But you should remember, 00:35:10.820 --> 00:35:12.000 that John's ministry, 00:35:12.519 --> 00:35:13.900 was distinct from Jesus. 00:35:14.040 --> 00:35:14.960 He had his own followers, 00:35:15.100 --> 00:35:16.220 he had his own location, 00:35:16.920 --> 00:35:18.420 and he had a very, 00:35:18.600 --> 00:35:19.780 very strong following. 00:35:19.860 --> 00:35:20.540 They knew about Jesus, 00:35:20.539 --> 00:35:21.519 maybe they even thought, 00:35:21.599 --> 00:35:21.980 oh Jesus, 00:35:22.259 --> 00:35:23.400 these guys are connected, 00:35:23.519 --> 00:35:23.900 they're buddies, 00:35:24.059 --> 00:35:24.460 they're pals. 00:35:24.800 --> 00:35:26.380 I can kind of like Jesus too, 00:35:26.440 --> 00:35:27.340 but John's my guy. 00:35:27.579 --> 00:35:27.759 You know, 00:35:27.779 --> 00:35:28.639 I'm going to stick with John, 00:35:28.699 --> 00:35:29.639 I'm not going to leave John now, 00:35:29.679 --> 00:35:30.259 and they'll follow Jesus. 00:35:30.759 --> 00:35:33.099 John was seen as a prophetic, 00:35:33.420 --> 00:35:35.539 messianic figure to his followers. 00:35:35.539 --> 00:35:37.139 And then finally, 00:35:37.639 --> 00:35:38.000 after, 00:35:38.599 --> 00:35:39.380 some years after, 00:35:39.759 --> 00:35:40.500 a man named Simon, 00:35:40.820 --> 00:35:41.559 Ben Kosiba, 00:35:42.300 --> 00:35:44.360 later known as Simon Bar Kokhba, 00:35:44.679 --> 00:35:46.259 son of Kosiba or Kokhba, 00:35:46.659 --> 00:35:48.759 was proclaimed to be God's anointed Messiah, 00:35:49.139 --> 00:35:50.579 by Rabbi Akiva, 00:35:50.960 --> 00:35:52.099 and led a four year rebellion, 00:35:52.179 --> 00:35:52.940 against Roman rule, 00:35:53.019 --> 00:35:54.739 until his movements crushing defeat, 00:35:54.800 --> 00:35:55.500 under Hadrian, 00:35:55.840 --> 00:35:56.900 in AD 136. 00:35:57.400 --> 00:35:57.659 Again, 00:35:57.739 --> 00:35:59.039 Rome came and crushed him. 00:35:59.519 --> 00:36:00.920 Why is it important to know, 00:36:01.019 --> 00:36:02.340 that these men, 00:36:02.460 --> 00:36:04.320 were roughly contemporaries, 00:36:04.320 --> 00:36:04.740 of Jesus? 00:36:05.500 --> 00:36:05.920 Well, 00:36:05.940 --> 00:36:06.420 that's because, 00:36:06.740 --> 00:36:07.519 after they died, 00:36:08.260 --> 00:36:09.460 their individual movements, 00:36:09.680 --> 00:36:10.440 died with them. 00:36:10.900 --> 00:36:11.980 There was no lasting, 00:36:12.160 --> 00:36:12.900 cult worship. 00:36:13.360 --> 00:36:13.900 Cult here, 00:36:14.039 --> 00:36:14.180 again, 00:36:14.240 --> 00:36:14.780 is a word, 00:36:15.240 --> 00:36:16.360 lowercase c, 00:36:16.420 --> 00:36:18.019 I don't mean modern day cult, 00:36:18.100 --> 00:36:18.720 so when you think of them, 00:36:18.760 --> 00:36:19.480 cult worship, 00:36:19.840 --> 00:36:20.740 it's just a way of saying, 00:36:21.000 --> 00:36:22.080 that a sort of, 00:36:22.160 --> 00:36:23.059 almost like a religion, 00:36:23.380 --> 00:36:24.240 formed around, 00:36:24.660 --> 00:36:26.080 an individual, 00:36:26.559 --> 00:36:27.400 the fastest growing, 00:36:28.080 --> 00:36:29.059 cult worship, 00:36:29.700 --> 00:36:30.460 in the first century, 00:36:30.460 --> 00:36:31.380 was the Roman, 00:36:31.600 --> 00:36:31.960 the emperor, 00:36:32.180 --> 00:36:33.460 the Caesar cult, 00:36:33.460 --> 00:36:35.260 worship of Caesar, 00:36:35.760 --> 00:36:38.960 as God. 00:36:40.019 --> 00:36:40.179 So, 00:36:40.300 --> 00:36:41.039 that's what I mean there, 00:36:41.360 --> 00:36:43.099 by cult worship. 00:36:43.460 --> 00:36:43.559 So, 00:36:43.639 --> 00:36:44.260 there was no lasting, 00:36:44.260 --> 00:36:44.800 cult worship, 00:36:44.840 --> 00:36:46.380 of these other individuals, 00:36:46.780 --> 00:36:47.900 no claims of resurrection, 00:36:48.340 --> 00:36:49.539 nor even spiritual visions, 00:36:49.639 --> 00:36:50.380 or visitations, 00:36:50.599 --> 00:36:51.079 and certainly, 00:36:51.199 --> 00:36:52.539 no lasting exaltation. 00:36:52.780 --> 00:36:52.980 So, 00:36:53.059 --> 00:36:54.039 here's the point, 00:36:54.119 --> 00:36:54.199 right? 00:36:54.220 --> 00:36:54.880 Here's the question, 00:36:54.940 --> 00:36:55.900 that we should ask ourselves. 00:36:56.260 --> 00:36:56.960 Here's where this, 00:36:57.220 --> 00:36:57.500 sort of, 00:36:57.500 --> 00:36:58.500 the defense, 00:36:58.500 --> 00:36:59.780 the defense of the resurrection, 00:37:00.000 --> 00:37:00.260 comes in. 00:37:00.880 --> 00:37:01.179 If, 00:37:01.440 --> 00:37:02.519 as liberal scholarship, 00:37:02.519 --> 00:37:03.219 wants to believe, 00:37:03.559 --> 00:37:04.340 Jesus' stories, 00:37:04.440 --> 00:37:05.360 developed slowly, 00:37:05.460 --> 00:37:06.179 over time, 00:37:06.320 --> 00:37:07.360 through oral tradition, 00:37:08.000 --> 00:37:09.039 and no element, 00:37:09.139 --> 00:37:10.460 of a fundamental truth, 00:37:10.500 --> 00:37:11.099 is needed, 00:37:11.340 --> 00:37:11.880 to kick the, 00:37:11.980 --> 00:37:12.400 you know, 00:37:12.480 --> 00:37:12.900 they're saying, 00:37:13.079 --> 00:37:13.300 you know, 00:37:13.400 --> 00:37:13.880 obviously, 00:37:13.980 --> 00:37:14.380 he didn't really, 00:37:14.780 --> 00:37:15.699 he wasn't really raised, 00:37:15.739 --> 00:37:16.039 from the dead, 00:37:16.059 --> 00:37:16.759 you don't need that, 00:37:16.820 --> 00:37:17.500 to get this, 00:37:17.500 --> 00:37:18.840 tradition started. 00:37:20.900 --> 00:37:22.099 The truth is not needed, 00:37:22.099 --> 00:37:22.880 to kick the stories off, 00:37:22.920 --> 00:37:23.400 into a cycle, 00:37:23.460 --> 00:37:24.199 of change and embellishment. 00:37:24.739 --> 00:37:25.639 Why didn't similar, 00:37:25.840 --> 00:37:26.159 fictional, 00:37:26.340 --> 00:37:27.119 oral traditions, 00:37:27.460 --> 00:37:27.900 arise, 00:37:28.000 --> 00:37:28.679 around the other, 00:37:28.759 --> 00:37:29.360 Messiah figures, 00:37:29.360 --> 00:37:30.280 of the first century, 00:37:30.680 --> 00:37:31.640 second temple period. 00:37:32.820 --> 00:37:33.500 Scholars don't have, 00:37:33.559 --> 00:37:34.519 a good explanation for this. 00:37:35.380 --> 00:37:36.740 What was it about Jesus? 00:37:36.820 --> 00:37:37.220 Because again, 00:37:37.300 --> 00:37:37.860 they're starting, 00:37:37.980 --> 00:37:38.559 with the assumption, 00:37:38.760 --> 00:37:39.700 that Jesus was, 00:37:40.180 --> 00:37:41.180 the same as these other, 00:37:41.720 --> 00:37:42.180 fellows. 00:37:43.019 --> 00:37:43.880 They don't believe, 00:37:43.940 --> 00:37:44.920 that Jesus was the son of God. 00:37:44.980 --> 00:37:45.440 They don't believe, 00:37:45.500 --> 00:37:46.480 that Jesus rose from the dead. 00:37:46.740 --> 00:37:47.200 To them, 00:37:47.340 --> 00:37:47.640 Jesus, 00:37:48.380 --> 00:37:49.240 and Judas, 00:37:49.780 --> 00:37:50.620 and John the Baptist, 00:37:51.220 --> 00:37:51.840 and Simon, 00:37:52.240 --> 00:37:52.460 then, 00:37:52.780 --> 00:37:53.120 Kosiba, 00:37:53.119 --> 00:37:54.299 are all, 00:37:54.299 --> 00:37:58.659 charismatic, 00:37:59.359 --> 00:37:59.920 cultural, 00:38:00.199 --> 00:38:01.299 slash political leaders, 00:38:01.880 --> 00:38:03.539 who had strong followings, 00:38:04.039 --> 00:38:04.940 who challenged, 00:38:05.119 --> 00:38:05.759 Roman rule, 00:38:06.259 --> 00:38:07.480 some militarily, 00:38:07.920 --> 00:38:09.000 some philosophically. 00:38:10.400 --> 00:38:11.039 What, 00:38:11.239 --> 00:38:12.779 is it about Jesus, 00:38:12.980 --> 00:38:14.159 that caused, 00:38:14.659 --> 00:38:15.639 not only for his, 00:38:15.859 --> 00:38:16.500 sort of story, 00:38:16.579 --> 00:38:17.319 not to die out, 00:38:18.099 --> 00:38:18.359 but, 00:38:18.659 --> 00:38:19.099 to quite, 00:38:19.259 --> 00:38:19.980 to do the opposite, 00:38:20.119 --> 00:38:20.980 to have an immediate, 00:38:20.980 --> 00:38:23.780 acknowledgement, 00:38:24.000 --> 00:38:25.119 of him as Lord. 00:38:25.219 --> 00:38:25.400 Again, 00:38:25.440 --> 00:38:25.960 we call this, 00:38:26.019 --> 00:38:26.880 high Christology. 00:38:27.240 --> 00:38:27.639 Not just, 00:38:27.860 --> 00:38:28.579 he was a great guy, 00:38:28.639 --> 00:38:29.240 we remember him. 00:38:29.639 --> 00:38:30.039 We have not, 00:38:30.179 --> 00:38:30.380 no, 00:38:30.500 --> 00:38:31.659 he was God's son. 00:38:31.760 --> 00:38:32.780 He was the Lord, 00:38:33.219 --> 00:38:34.460 very early on, 00:38:35.059 --> 00:38:36.019 and then have that, 00:38:36.480 --> 00:38:37.380 take over, 00:38:37.480 --> 00:38:38.860 not just their local population, 00:38:39.199 --> 00:38:40.179 but then to explode, 00:38:40.619 --> 00:38:42.159 across the near east, 00:38:42.500 --> 00:38:44.400 across the Roman Empire. 00:38:44.840 --> 00:38:45.280 What, 00:38:45.539 --> 00:38:46.199 went on, 00:38:46.280 --> 00:38:46.820 with Jesus, 00:38:47.000 --> 00:38:47.880 that didn't go on, 00:38:47.920 --> 00:38:48.780 with these other figures. 00:38:49.119 --> 00:38:50.000 That when they died, 00:38:50.099 --> 00:38:50.519 that was it. 00:38:50.519 --> 00:38:51.800 People packed their bags, 00:38:51.860 --> 00:38:52.239 and went home. 00:38:53.000 --> 00:38:53.420 We say, 00:38:53.659 --> 00:38:54.099 obviously, 00:38:54.280 --> 00:38:55.259 something different, 00:38:55.380 --> 00:38:56.059 did happen with Jesus, 00:38:56.380 --> 00:38:56.820 and that is, 00:38:56.900 --> 00:38:58.019 that Jesus rose from the dead, 00:38:58.340 --> 00:38:59.639 that people saw him, 00:38:59.940 --> 00:39:01.599 raised from the dead, 00:39:01.820 --> 00:39:02.980 that they talked to people, 00:39:03.019 --> 00:39:03.679 who saw him, 00:39:03.920 --> 00:39:05.179 and that this was something, 00:39:05.360 --> 00:39:06.579 that people believed, 00:39:06.719 --> 00:39:07.780 they knew that this, 00:39:07.900 --> 00:39:08.679 wasn't just a hoax. 00:39:10.619 --> 00:39:11.460 And so that's why, 00:39:11.519 --> 00:39:11.960 it's important, 00:39:12.699 --> 00:39:13.759 to familiarize yourself, 00:39:13.880 --> 00:39:15.579 with the Messiah figure, 00:39:15.759 --> 00:39:16.199 if you will, 00:39:16.219 --> 00:39:16.840 in the first century, 00:39:17.059 --> 00:39:17.860 to understand that, 00:39:17.960 --> 00:39:18.159 there were, 00:39:18.480 --> 00:39:19.840 a number of them, 00:39:19.840 --> 00:39:21.000 and that none of them, 00:39:21.079 --> 00:39:21.920 had any sort of following, 00:39:22.000 --> 00:39:22.600 after they died, 00:39:23.019 --> 00:39:24.100 and yet Jesus' following, 00:39:24.240 --> 00:39:24.740 explodes, 00:39:25.000 --> 00:39:26.079 and transforms the entire, 00:39:26.559 --> 00:39:27.059 Roman Empire, 00:39:27.220 --> 00:39:28.340 transforms the entire world. 00:39:29.360 --> 00:39:29.600 Peter. 00:39:29.880 --> 00:39:30.039 Yeah. 00:39:30.280 --> 00:39:31.200 Isn't it true also, 00:39:31.320 --> 00:39:32.400 that when he rose from the dead, 00:39:32.460 --> 00:39:34.220 he just didn't reveal himself, 00:39:34.400 --> 00:39:35.400 to a couple of people? 00:39:36.000 --> 00:39:36.800 Wasn't he seen, 00:39:36.900 --> 00:39:38.240 by four or five hundred people? 00:39:38.440 --> 00:39:38.680 Yes. 00:39:38.700 --> 00:39:39.280 During that time? 00:39:39.500 --> 00:39:39.820 Yes. 00:39:40.660 --> 00:39:41.100 Correct. 00:39:41.519 --> 00:39:41.740 Yes. 00:39:41.739 --> 00:39:43.819 Does the dating of the epistles, 00:39:44.179 --> 00:39:45.319 and the gospels, 00:39:45.559 --> 00:39:46.839 suggest that, 00:39:47.159 --> 00:39:48.239 the stories about Jesus, 00:39:48.379 --> 00:39:49.779 weren't changing over time, 00:39:49.899 --> 00:39:51.000 or that not enough time, 00:39:51.079 --> 00:39:53.199 had passed for them to have changed? 00:39:53.239 --> 00:39:53.559 Correct. 00:39:53.719 --> 00:39:53.819 Yeah. 00:39:53.919 --> 00:39:54.519 Liberal scholars, 00:39:54.699 --> 00:39:55.459 liberal scholars, 00:39:55.459 --> 00:39:57.159 who are intellectually honest, 00:39:57.279 --> 00:39:57.739 would say, 00:39:58.839 --> 00:39:59.439 like they would say, 00:39:59.519 --> 00:40:00.559 yes I can see to you, 00:40:00.599 --> 00:40:02.079 that if this letter, 00:40:02.239 --> 00:40:02.779 was really written, 00:40:02.899 --> 00:40:03.459 at this time, 00:40:03.519 --> 00:40:04.479 or if this gospel, 00:40:04.639 --> 00:40:05.019 was really written, 00:40:05.079 --> 00:40:06.259 at this time, 00:40:06.719 --> 00:40:08.159 no there was not enough time, 00:40:08.159 --> 00:40:09.099 to have this, 00:40:09.159 --> 00:40:10.059 sort of hero, 00:40:10.259 --> 00:40:11.000 legendary, 00:40:11.179 --> 00:40:11.859 kind of development, 00:40:12.079 --> 00:40:12.399 takes place, 00:40:12.420 --> 00:40:13.359 they concede that point, 00:40:13.699 --> 00:40:14.460 they would simply say, 00:40:14.579 --> 00:40:15.159 I just don't think, 00:40:15.179 --> 00:40:15.980 it was written that early, 00:40:16.659 --> 00:40:17.819 and they stick to that, 00:40:17.940 --> 00:40:18.059 you know, 00:40:18.059 --> 00:40:18.679 they hold to that. 00:40:19.879 --> 00:40:20.759 So now I'll just talk, 00:40:20.799 --> 00:40:21.359 a little bit about, 00:40:21.619 --> 00:40:22.319 Richard Baucom, 00:40:22.819 --> 00:40:24.319 and an eyewitness testimony, 00:40:24.799 --> 00:40:25.879 again this is an important, 00:40:26.039 --> 00:40:27.639 sort of apologetical point, 00:40:27.980 --> 00:40:28.739 to understanding, 00:40:29.480 --> 00:40:30.859 well you know, 00:40:31.039 --> 00:40:31.940 we believe in the resurrection, 00:40:32.119 --> 00:40:32.799 why do we believe in it, 00:40:32.819 --> 00:40:33.699 why do we think it's historical? 00:40:34.159 --> 00:40:34.519 Baucom, 00:40:34.920 --> 00:40:36.339 teaches at St. Andrews, 00:40:36.859 --> 00:40:37.099 he's, 00:40:37.099 --> 00:40:39.380 excellent biblical scholar, 00:40:39.639 --> 00:40:40.059 Old Testament, 00:40:40.159 --> 00:40:40.480 New Testament, 00:40:41.480 --> 00:40:42.880 he has his hands, 00:40:42.920 --> 00:40:43.539 in a lot of areas, 00:40:43.940 --> 00:40:44.400 but you know, 00:40:44.420 --> 00:40:45.179 he maybe perhaps, 00:40:45.239 --> 00:40:45.799 found his calling, 00:40:45.920 --> 00:40:47.279 focusing specifically on, 00:40:48.239 --> 00:40:49.559 the eyewitness testimony, 00:40:50.119 --> 00:40:50.839 in the gospels, 00:40:50.960 --> 00:40:51.380 and so, 00:40:51.980 --> 00:40:52.699 I can maybe, 00:40:52.860 --> 00:40:53.460 lean a little bit more, 00:40:53.519 --> 00:40:54.039 on the bullet points, 00:40:54.119 --> 00:40:55.480 because I was able to write it out, 00:40:55.539 --> 00:40:56.500 in somewhat of a concise way, 00:40:57.019 --> 00:40:58.319 Baucom suggests, 00:40:58.779 --> 00:40:59.460 that the gospels, 00:40:59.539 --> 00:41:00.880 are a kind of historiography, 00:41:01.099 --> 00:41:02.119 known as testimony, 00:41:02.460 --> 00:41:03.420 remember I was saying before, 00:41:03.779 --> 00:41:04.779 what are the gospels, 00:41:04.779 --> 00:41:05.880 we have to first establish, 00:41:06.039 --> 00:41:06.699 what are these things, 00:41:06.699 --> 00:41:07.939 as literary works, 00:41:08.460 --> 00:41:09.460 and why is that important, 00:41:09.519 --> 00:41:10.539 to understanding the resurrection, 00:41:11.699 --> 00:41:13.039 he feels more than anything, 00:41:13.179 --> 00:41:13.980 that we should think of them, 00:41:14.159 --> 00:41:15.259 as testimonies, 00:41:15.659 --> 00:41:16.839 and I'm talking almost, 00:41:17.019 --> 00:41:18.139 in a forensic, 00:41:18.279 --> 00:41:19.319 kind of a law court sense, 00:41:19.719 --> 00:41:21.099 that these are the official, 00:41:21.299 --> 00:41:22.000 recordings, 00:41:22.259 --> 00:41:23.899 of things that people saw, 00:41:24.039 --> 00:41:25.239 and the things that Jesus did, 00:41:25.819 --> 00:41:26.659 he feels that, 00:41:26.779 --> 00:41:28.039 that is the most historically, 00:41:28.039 --> 00:41:28.719 accurate way, 00:41:28.759 --> 00:41:30.119 of treating those documents, 00:41:30.759 --> 00:41:31.559 testimony, 00:41:31.779 --> 00:41:32.559 he feels enables us, 00:41:32.559 --> 00:41:33.239 to read the gospels, 00:41:33.239 --> 00:41:34.279 in both historical, 00:41:34.479 --> 00:41:35.139 and theological, 00:41:35.139 --> 00:41:36.279 ways, 00:41:36.659 --> 00:41:37.739 that they were written, 00:41:38.000 --> 00:41:38.899 so that we would, 00:41:38.959 --> 00:41:40.279 infer both historical fact, 00:41:40.339 --> 00:41:40.599 from them, 00:41:40.679 --> 00:41:41.939 and theological significance, 00:41:41.939 --> 00:41:42.559 from them, 00:41:43.159 --> 00:41:43.659 Baucom's views, 00:41:43.739 --> 00:41:44.439 are much different, 00:41:44.519 --> 00:41:45.079 from the views, 00:41:45.199 --> 00:41:45.859 of those who have been, 00:41:45.919 --> 00:41:46.959 influenced by form, 00:41:47.199 --> 00:41:47.599 criticism, 00:41:48.099 --> 00:41:48.899 those influenced, 00:41:48.959 --> 00:41:49.679 by form criticism, 00:41:49.819 --> 00:41:50.319 assume that there was, 00:41:50.359 --> 00:41:51.299 a long anonymous, 00:41:51.479 --> 00:41:52.539 transmission of traditions, 00:41:52.839 --> 00:41:53.699 from the time, 00:41:53.739 --> 00:41:54.539 of the eyewitnesses, 00:41:54.619 --> 00:41:55.059 to the time, 00:41:55.119 --> 00:41:55.939 the gospels were written, 00:41:56.479 --> 00:41:57.619 those who hold this view, 00:41:57.619 --> 00:41:58.359 may disagree, 00:41:58.500 --> 00:41:59.339 about whether the traditions, 00:41:59.439 --> 00:42:00.239 were carefully preserved, 00:42:00.379 --> 00:42:01.159 or heavily adapted, 00:42:01.159 --> 00:42:02.019 but they agree, 00:42:02.119 --> 00:42:02.980 that eyewitness testimony, 00:42:03.099 --> 00:42:04.399 had little direct connection, 00:42:04.960 --> 00:42:05.940 with what was written down, 00:42:06.000 --> 00:42:06.559 in the gospels, 00:42:06.879 --> 00:42:07.399 obviously, 00:42:07.500 --> 00:42:07.819 Baucom, 00:42:08.279 --> 00:42:09.639 strongly disagrees with this, 00:42:09.899 --> 00:42:10.739 and feels that, 00:42:11.239 --> 00:42:12.119 the gospel writers, 00:42:12.579 --> 00:42:13.179 received, 00:42:13.359 --> 00:42:14.279 not just, 00:42:15.119 --> 00:42:16.239 fish stories, 00:42:16.420 --> 00:42:16.859 if you will, 00:42:17.059 --> 00:42:17.759 that sort of classic, 00:42:17.899 --> 00:42:18.539 like oh I caught a, 00:42:18.639 --> 00:42:19.000 it was five, 00:42:19.119 --> 00:42:20.779 the thing was 50 pounds, 00:42:21.299 --> 00:42:23.119 that's not what the gospel writers, 00:42:23.119 --> 00:42:23.839 were receiving, 00:42:23.980 --> 00:42:24.440 and saying oh, 00:42:24.559 --> 00:42:25.219 that's interesting, 00:42:25.339 --> 00:42:26.179 let me write that down, 00:42:26.460 --> 00:42:27.739 that they received, 00:42:28.239 --> 00:42:29.299 eyewitness, 00:42:29.500 --> 00:42:31.019 official testimony, 00:42:31.159 --> 00:42:32.079 that was, 00:42:32.139 --> 00:42:33.980 that was transmitted orally, 00:42:34.399 --> 00:42:35.899 for almost 20 years, 00:42:36.460 --> 00:42:36.899 faithfully, 00:42:37.119 --> 00:42:38.440 for the purpose of, 00:42:38.440 --> 00:42:38.819 of, 00:42:38.819 --> 00:42:39.239 of, 00:42:39.239 --> 00:42:40.739 of faithfully, 00:42:40.859 --> 00:42:42.739 maintaining, 00:42:43.079 --> 00:42:44.000 the truth about Jesus, 00:42:44.219 --> 00:42:44.839 the truth about, 00:42:44.960 --> 00:42:46.179 the work of his church, 00:42:46.299 --> 00:42:46.500 and, 00:42:46.539 --> 00:42:47.659 and sort of the expansion, 00:42:47.659 --> 00:42:48.339 of that church, 00:42:48.980 --> 00:42:50.940 and, 00:42:51.039 --> 00:42:51.599 in, 00:42:51.679 --> 00:42:52.819 in regard to this assumption, 00:42:53.179 --> 00:42:53.659 that the liberal, 00:42:53.819 --> 00:42:54.920 liberal scholarship takes, 00:42:55.699 --> 00:42:56.199 Baucom says, 00:42:56.239 --> 00:42:56.819 that there's a simple, 00:42:56.899 --> 00:42:57.739 and obvious problem, 00:42:57.739 --> 00:42:58.879 with that assumption, 00:42:58.880 --> 00:42:59.920 it assumes, 00:42:59.920 --> 00:43:00.780 that I would, 00:43:00.880 --> 00:43:01.519 the eyewitnesses, 00:43:01.559 --> 00:43:02.360 vanished immediately, 00:43:02.360 --> 00:43:03.660 after Jesus's ministry, 00:43:04.200 --> 00:43:04.559 accepting, 00:43:04.920 --> 00:43:05.780 the commonly held dates, 00:43:05.820 --> 00:43:06.400 of the gospels, 00:43:06.480 --> 00:43:06.720 however, 00:43:07.059 --> 00:43:08.019 means the evangelists, 00:43:08.119 --> 00:43:09.059 were writing about events, 00:43:09.340 --> 00:43:10.300 within living memory, 00:43:10.700 --> 00:43:11.640 again, 00:43:11.720 --> 00:43:12.500 an important point, 00:43:12.840 --> 00:43:13.880 if a 10 year old, 00:43:13.920 --> 00:43:14.740 or a 12 year old, 00:43:14.960 --> 00:43:15.960 was there, 00:43:16.059 --> 00:43:16.980 and saw the risen Jesus, 00:43:17.619 --> 00:43:18.240 and that individual, 00:43:18.440 --> 00:43:19.640 lived to 60, 00:43:19.720 --> 00:43:20.039 or 70, 00:43:20.119 --> 00:43:20.840 or 80 years old, 00:43:21.220 --> 00:43:22.420 and told people, 00:43:22.500 --> 00:43:23.360 about what he saw, 00:43:23.360 --> 00:43:25.800 the window, 00:43:25.940 --> 00:43:26.660 in which we say, 00:43:27.079 --> 00:43:27.760 this is the window, 00:43:27.760 --> 00:43:28.460 where we have, 00:43:28.500 --> 00:43:30.039 reliable eyewitness testimony, 00:43:30.300 --> 00:43:31.180 is much bigger, 00:43:31.539 --> 00:43:32.340 than liberal scholarship, 00:43:32.599 --> 00:43:33.059 kind of want, 00:43:33.099 --> 00:43:33.599 they want to say, 00:43:33.740 --> 00:43:35.480 it's just very little tiny, 00:43:35.620 --> 00:43:36.480 basically Jesus, 00:43:36.480 --> 00:43:37.260 was seen by like, 00:43:37.300 --> 00:43:38.120 three 90 year olds, 00:43:38.200 --> 00:43:38.740 and then they died, 00:43:38.800 --> 00:43:39.400 like the next day, 00:43:39.840 --> 00:43:40.099 you know, 00:43:40.320 --> 00:43:41.160 no, 00:43:41.360 --> 00:43:43.120 no, 00:43:43.180 --> 00:43:43.820 that's not what happened, 00:43:44.180 --> 00:43:45.120 you see by many people, 00:43:45.460 --> 00:43:46.140 some very young, 00:43:46.440 --> 00:43:47.360 and they lived their whole lives, 00:43:47.420 --> 00:43:47.840 saying yeah, 00:43:48.000 --> 00:43:49.019 I saw him, 00:43:49.160 --> 00:43:49.740 I see he was, 00:43:49.860 --> 00:43:50.960 he was dead on a cross, 00:43:51.000 --> 00:43:52.280 and then I saw him alive later, 00:43:52.280 --> 00:43:55.300 some characters, 00:43:55.700 --> 00:43:56.500 and again, 00:43:56.560 --> 00:43:57.300 I'm going to touch a little bit, 00:43:57.440 --> 00:43:58.480 on some of his more specific, 00:43:58.740 --> 00:44:00.080 kind of the specific points, 00:44:00.120 --> 00:44:00.440 he makes, 00:44:00.960 --> 00:44:01.680 so some characters, 00:44:01.780 --> 00:44:02.440 in the gospels, 00:44:03.260 --> 00:44:04.400 are named, 00:44:04.500 --> 00:44:05.300 while others are not, 00:44:05.640 --> 00:44:06.200 so Bauckham, 00:44:06.400 --> 00:44:06.840 as a scholar, 00:44:07.040 --> 00:44:08.500 would put forth the argument, 00:44:08.620 --> 00:44:09.440 that that is significant, 00:44:10.100 --> 00:44:11.000 that some characters, 00:44:11.080 --> 00:44:11.519 in the gospels, 00:44:11.560 --> 00:44:11.780 are named, 00:44:11.840 --> 00:44:12.660 while others are not, 00:44:12.840 --> 00:44:13.540 Bauckham proposes, 00:44:14.160 --> 00:44:14.740 that that, 00:44:14.880 --> 00:44:16.080 that those characters, 00:44:16.080 --> 00:44:16.740 who are named, 00:44:16.860 --> 00:44:17.840 were eyewitnesses, 00:44:17.900 --> 00:44:19.120 who originated the traditions, 00:44:19.240 --> 00:44:20.380 to which their names are attached, 00:44:20.700 --> 00:44:22.019 and continue to tell, 00:44:22.019 --> 00:44:22.579 their stories, 00:44:22.699 --> 00:44:24.380 as authoritative guarantors, 00:44:24.500 --> 00:44:25.719 of their traditions, 00:44:26.059 --> 00:44:26.719 the evangelists, 00:44:26.800 --> 00:44:27.579 may have known, 00:44:28.139 --> 00:44:29.259 these eyewitnesses, 00:44:29.280 --> 00:44:29.840 in some cases, 00:44:30.199 --> 00:44:31.519 so again, 00:44:31.619 --> 00:44:32.420 if you're presupposing, 00:44:32.539 --> 00:44:33.239 that the gospels are, 00:44:33.440 --> 00:44:33.960 made up, 00:44:34.940 --> 00:44:35.820 and you're thinking, 00:44:35.960 --> 00:44:36.739 somebody sat down, 00:44:36.840 --> 00:44:37.980 and wrote a lie, 00:44:38.400 --> 00:44:38.800 this is, 00:44:38.900 --> 00:44:39.880 this is their assumption, 00:44:40.460 --> 00:44:41.539 and this is what we're, 00:44:41.599 --> 00:44:42.659 sort of arguing against, 00:44:43.320 --> 00:44:43.960 why, 00:44:44.639 --> 00:44:46.019 does it take the literary form, 00:44:46.059 --> 00:44:46.719 but why is he saying, 00:44:46.840 --> 00:44:46.920 oh, 00:44:47.119 --> 00:44:48.000 so I went there, 00:44:48.159 --> 00:44:49.780 and a random man did this, 00:44:49.780 --> 00:44:51.680 and a random man did that, 00:44:51.980 --> 00:44:52.800 but then Paul, 00:44:52.900 --> 00:44:54.340 who was the son of Mark, 00:44:54.460 --> 00:44:55.160 said this, 00:44:55.800 --> 00:44:57.340 it doesn't make sense, 00:44:57.700 --> 00:44:59.000 if the whole thing is made up, 00:44:59.620 --> 00:45:00.560 you would either invent names, 00:45:00.600 --> 00:45:01.019 for everybody, 00:45:01.180 --> 00:45:02.240 or you would invent names, 00:45:02.340 --> 00:45:02.780 for nobody, 00:45:02.880 --> 00:45:03.400 for nobody, 00:45:03.940 --> 00:45:05.140 but that's not what we find, 00:45:05.380 --> 00:45:05.860 we find, 00:45:06.200 --> 00:45:06.780 and it crossed, 00:45:07.500 --> 00:45:08.040 now of course, 00:45:08.080 --> 00:45:08.780 there is some variation, 00:45:08.880 --> 00:45:09.360 between Mark, 00:45:09.420 --> 00:45:09.720 and Matthew, 00:45:09.800 --> 00:45:09.960 and Luke, 00:45:10.040 --> 00:45:10.720 but there is, 00:45:10.800 --> 00:45:12.580 there is a lot of agreement, 00:45:12.980 --> 00:45:13.740 where you would have, 00:45:14.400 --> 00:45:15.780 sort of unnamed person, 00:45:15.920 --> 00:45:16.600 unnamed person, 00:45:16.599 --> 00:45:17.980 and a very specific, 00:45:18.380 --> 00:45:19.420 named person, 00:45:19.659 --> 00:45:20.039 and women, 00:45:20.119 --> 00:45:20.699 so on and so forth, 00:45:21.319 --> 00:45:22.900 and Richard Baucom, 00:45:22.940 --> 00:45:23.319 is saying, 00:45:23.639 --> 00:45:24.480 that's not by accident, 00:45:24.819 --> 00:45:25.259 that's because, 00:45:25.420 --> 00:45:26.599 when these stories were told, 00:45:27.159 --> 00:45:27.519 the people, 00:45:27.699 --> 00:45:28.500 the eyewitnesses, 00:45:28.539 --> 00:45:29.119 who are faithfully, 00:45:29.199 --> 00:45:29.940 retelling these stories, 00:45:30.460 --> 00:45:30.799 said, 00:45:30.940 --> 00:45:31.039 yeah, 00:45:31.079 --> 00:45:32.099 we don't remember, 00:45:32.179 --> 00:45:33.059 who that person's name was, 00:45:33.139 --> 00:45:34.079 and Jesus healed somebody, 00:45:34.199 --> 00:45:35.420 we don't remember that name, 00:45:35.500 --> 00:45:35.860 but then, 00:45:35.920 --> 00:45:37.019 when he went and talked to so and so, 00:45:37.059 --> 00:45:38.339 we know that it was this person, 00:45:38.699 --> 00:45:39.819 and so on and so forth, 00:45:39.960 --> 00:45:40.779 so names, 00:45:41.079 --> 00:45:42.119 why they are there, 00:45:42.179 --> 00:45:42.860 versus not there, 00:45:42.980 --> 00:45:43.839 becomes hugely important, 00:45:44.360 --> 00:45:45.599 in saying, 00:45:45.599 --> 00:45:47.099 this is really eyewitness testimony, 00:45:47.239 --> 00:45:48.699 or it isn't, 00:45:48.699 --> 00:45:50.639 public figures, 00:45:50.759 --> 00:45:51.339 John the Baptist, 00:45:51.539 --> 00:45:51.819 Herod, 00:45:51.980 --> 00:45:52.420 Herodias, 00:45:52.559 --> 00:45:52.880 Caiaphas, 00:45:52.980 --> 00:45:53.279 Pilate, 00:45:53.639 --> 00:45:54.619 and the disciples of Jesus, 00:45:54.719 --> 00:45:55.500 are usually named, 00:45:55.659 --> 00:45:57.000 those who are healed by Jesus, 00:45:57.079 --> 00:45:57.759 or encounter Jesus, 00:45:58.179 --> 00:45:59.079 on only one occasion, 00:45:59.159 --> 00:46:00.000 are usually unnamed, 00:46:00.440 --> 00:46:01.059 and that's because, 00:46:01.299 --> 00:46:01.860 that again, 00:46:02.000 --> 00:46:03.679 this rings as true historically, 00:46:04.159 --> 00:46:05.420 they weren't super humans, 00:46:05.699 --> 00:46:06.739 they were normal people, 00:46:06.920 --> 00:46:07.679 so they maybe, 00:46:07.679 --> 00:46:08.839 did forget some things, 00:46:09.319 --> 00:46:09.920 they maybe forgot, 00:46:10.059 --> 00:46:11.179 I don't remember exactly, 00:46:11.279 --> 00:46:12.059 the name of that person, 00:46:12.199 --> 00:46:13.039 that was there, 00:46:13.139 --> 00:46:14.539 when Jesus was walking that day, 00:46:14.539 --> 00:46:15.400 and healed that person, 00:46:15.599 --> 00:46:16.719 but I certainly remember, 00:46:16.819 --> 00:46:17.559 these other things, 00:46:17.839 --> 00:46:18.319 again, 00:46:18.460 --> 00:46:18.819 it is, 00:46:19.039 --> 00:46:19.440 it, 00:46:19.440 --> 00:46:19.739 it, 00:46:19.739 --> 00:46:21.839 it kind of falls in line, 00:46:22.119 --> 00:46:23.159 with things that ring, 00:46:23.219 --> 00:46:24.380 as historically accurate, 00:46:24.519 --> 00:46:24.960 and true, 00:46:25.219 --> 00:46:26.420 and fly against, 00:46:26.960 --> 00:46:27.920 this idea of, 00:46:28.059 --> 00:46:28.440 well this was, 00:46:28.500 --> 00:46:29.380 this was manufactured, 00:46:30.139 --> 00:46:31.460 if things were manufactured, 00:46:31.779 --> 00:46:32.480 Bauckham is arguing, 00:46:32.659 --> 00:46:33.679 they should look different, 00:46:33.779 --> 00:46:35.059 they shouldn't look like this then, 00:46:35.059 --> 00:46:36.779 I also think it's, 00:46:36.779 --> 00:46:40.440 it's good to think about that too, 00:46:40.500 --> 00:46:41.119 because I feel like, 00:46:41.159 --> 00:46:41.679 a lot of times, 00:46:41.759 --> 00:46:42.440 we think about, 00:46:42.920 --> 00:46:43.619 the Bible, 00:46:43.840 --> 00:46:44.320 as like, 00:46:44.360 --> 00:46:45.360 these men sat down, 00:46:45.480 --> 00:46:46.219 and then the Holy Spirit, 00:46:46.219 --> 00:46:46.799 came and like, 00:46:46.900 --> 00:46:47.340 sprinkled, 00:46:47.480 --> 00:46:48.219 sprinkled something, 00:46:48.299 --> 00:46:48.920 over their head, 00:46:49.000 --> 00:46:49.539 and then they like, 00:46:49.599 --> 00:46:49.820 just, 00:46:50.179 --> 00:46:50.960 vigorously were writing, 00:46:51.019 --> 00:46:51.799 with their eyes closed, 00:46:51.860 --> 00:46:52.440 and the Holy Spirit, 00:46:52.519 --> 00:46:52.699 like, 00:46:52.779 --> 00:46:54.059 that's not what happened, 00:46:54.139 --> 00:46:55.360 obviously we know that, 00:46:55.619 --> 00:46:56.759 the Holy Spirit and God, 00:46:57.119 --> 00:46:58.219 they were involved in, 00:46:58.299 --> 00:46:59.119 in making, 00:46:59.340 --> 00:47:00.460 what happened, 00:47:00.460 --> 00:47:01.780 happened on paper, 00:47:01.900 --> 00:47:02.199 happened, 00:47:02.420 --> 00:47:03.920 but it was also actually, 00:47:04.679 --> 00:47:05.500 really something, 00:47:05.639 --> 00:47:06.240 that was happening, 00:47:06.380 --> 00:47:07.440 it's not like a fairy tale, 00:47:07.460 --> 00:47:08.099 I feel like sometimes, 00:47:08.220 --> 00:47:09.360 we even as Christians, 00:47:09.480 --> 00:47:10.300 think about it as like, 00:47:10.460 --> 00:47:11.740 this fairy tale thing, 00:47:11.800 --> 00:47:12.280 that happened, 00:47:12.400 --> 00:47:12.760 like oh, 00:47:12.800 --> 00:47:13.380 and then the Bible, 00:47:13.480 --> 00:47:14.400 like fell down from heaven, 00:47:14.460 --> 00:47:15.159 and now we read it, 00:47:15.220 --> 00:47:15.800 like no, 00:47:15.840 --> 00:47:17.539 it actually was real stuff, 00:47:17.599 --> 00:47:18.220 that was happening, 00:47:18.860 --> 00:47:19.119 right, 00:47:22.400 --> 00:47:23.480 and the last bullet point, 00:47:23.579 --> 00:47:24.159 the synoptics, 00:47:24.639 --> 00:47:25.539 and this is something, 00:47:25.699 --> 00:47:26.179 that Greg hit on, 00:47:26.220 --> 00:47:26.860 Greg did a good job, 00:47:26.920 --> 00:47:27.559 of incorporating this, 00:47:27.639 --> 00:47:28.059 into his sermon, 00:47:28.179 --> 00:47:29.240 but it is a big part, 00:47:29.400 --> 00:47:29.980 of resurrection, 00:47:29.980 --> 00:47:30.780 apologetics, 00:47:31.380 --> 00:47:32.920 the women at the tomb, 00:47:33.159 --> 00:47:34.699 is hugely problematic, 00:47:35.019 --> 00:47:36.740 as Greg adequately pointed out, 00:47:36.980 --> 00:47:38.019 hugely problematic, 00:47:38.579 --> 00:47:39.619 for liberal, 00:47:39.980 --> 00:47:40.940 Bible scholarship, 00:47:41.199 --> 00:47:41.900 that wants to say, 00:47:42.039 --> 00:47:43.360 well these are stories, 00:47:43.420 --> 00:47:44.099 that developed, 00:47:44.320 --> 00:47:45.740 over a long period of time, 00:47:46.099 --> 00:47:46.820 they were made up, 00:47:46.880 --> 00:47:47.280 whole cloth, 00:47:47.380 --> 00:47:48.400 Jesus certainly didn't rise, 00:47:48.400 --> 00:47:48.920 from the dead, 00:47:49.019 --> 00:47:49.579 he was either, 00:47:50.300 --> 00:47:52.079 maybe somebody stole his body, 00:47:52.199 --> 00:47:53.539 or maybe that whole thing, 00:47:53.619 --> 00:47:54.740 about the tomb being empty, 00:47:54.840 --> 00:47:55.519 that's just a hoax, 00:47:55.619 --> 00:47:56.460 and the tomb is still there, 00:47:56.480 --> 00:47:57.059 and there's some body, 00:47:57.139 --> 00:47:57.820 that's still in it, 00:47:58.360 --> 00:47:59.860 there's a huge problem, 00:47:59.980 --> 00:48:00.820 with having, 00:48:01.079 --> 00:48:02.599 the women at the tomb, 00:48:03.360 --> 00:48:04.800 be the only, 00:48:04.920 --> 00:48:05.860 eyewitnesses, 00:48:06.059 --> 00:48:07.800 to Jesus's actual resurrection, 00:48:09.360 --> 00:48:09.980 yes, 00:48:10.079 --> 00:48:10.940 yes, 00:48:11.699 --> 00:48:14.240 what's that, 00:48:14.239 --> 00:48:16.799 they appeared on the road, 00:48:17.239 --> 00:48:17.519 yes, 00:48:17.619 --> 00:48:19.039 so how can you say, 00:48:19.139 --> 00:48:19.679 it's just the women, 00:48:19.779 --> 00:48:20.419 they were the first, 00:48:20.539 --> 00:48:21.139 because, 00:48:22.000 --> 00:48:22.799 at the tomb, 00:48:22.939 --> 00:48:23.459 oh sorry, 00:48:23.939 --> 00:48:24.519 right, 00:48:24.719 --> 00:48:25.779 so if you are, 00:48:25.919 --> 00:48:26.519 as Greg said, 00:48:26.879 --> 00:48:28.179 so if you're making this story up, 00:48:28.259 --> 00:48:29.000 and you want people, 00:48:29.000 --> 00:48:30.359 to take this story seriously, 00:48:30.959 --> 00:48:31.799 and guess what, 00:48:32.039 --> 00:48:33.579 people did take the story seriously, 00:48:33.719 --> 00:48:34.459 because Christianity, 00:48:34.699 --> 00:48:34.959 again, 00:48:35.059 --> 00:48:36.639 exploded across the Roman Empire, 00:48:37.119 --> 00:48:37.819 by 83, 00:48:38.019 --> 00:48:38.719 or 300, 00:48:38.919 --> 00:48:40.159 it's become the official religion, 00:48:40.219 --> 00:48:40.879 of the Roman Empire, 00:48:40.880 --> 00:48:40.980 there, 00:48:41.280 --> 00:48:41.880 so not only, 00:48:42.099 --> 00:48:42.480 were they, 00:48:42.599 --> 00:48:43.140 if then really, 00:48:43.539 --> 00:48:43.920 you know, 00:48:43.940 --> 00:48:44.340 these were probably, 00:48:44.340 --> 00:48:45.840 the smartest men that ever existed, 00:48:45.960 --> 00:48:46.900 if somebody made this up, 00:48:47.539 --> 00:48:47.740 you know, 00:48:47.739 --> 00:48:55.779 they weren't the first though, 00:48:56.039 --> 00:48:57.159 the women came back, 00:48:57.199 --> 00:48:57.699 and told them, 00:48:57.799 --> 00:48:58.399 and then they ran, 00:48:58.399 --> 00:48:58.899 and then they ran, 00:48:59.059 --> 00:48:59.899 to the empty tomb, 00:48:59.899 --> 00:49:01.739 no he's saying, 00:49:01.739 --> 00:49:02.519 the women, 00:49:02.719 --> 00:49:03.799 were the first, 00:49:04.079 --> 00:49:05.759 to see the risen Jesus, 00:49:06.139 --> 00:49:07.079 so let's, 00:49:07.259 --> 00:49:08.479 so here's the argument, 00:49:09.079 --> 00:49:09.839 let's assume, 00:49:10.059 --> 00:49:11.059 that this is a lie, 00:49:11.419 --> 00:49:12.639 that Jesus didn't raise from the dead, 00:49:12.679 --> 00:49:14.079 because people aren't raised from the dead, 00:49:14.619 --> 00:49:15.179 and I'm, 00:49:15.319 --> 00:49:16.959 but I want people to believe this lie, 00:49:16.960 --> 00:49:18.480 and I'm going to now, 00:49:18.500 --> 00:49:19.780 try to sell this lie to people, 00:49:20.280 --> 00:49:21.659 I'm not going to make, 00:49:21.840 --> 00:49:22.980 the only eyewitnesses, 00:49:23.159 --> 00:49:24.639 to Jesus in the tomb, 00:49:24.840 --> 00:49:25.099 women, 00:49:25.480 --> 00:49:26.300 because women didn't have, 00:49:26.360 --> 00:49:27.220 any legal status, 00:49:27.679 --> 00:49:27.940 women, 00:49:28.659 --> 00:49:28.940 again, 00:49:29.059 --> 00:49:29.840 as Greg pointed out, 00:49:29.940 --> 00:49:30.220 were just, 00:49:30.380 --> 00:49:31.119 legally, 00:49:31.639 --> 00:49:32.099 culturally, 00:49:32.519 --> 00:49:33.679 at every level, 00:49:33.820 --> 00:49:34.639 were seen as inferior, 00:49:35.199 --> 00:49:36.820 were seen as unimportant, 00:49:37.699 --> 00:49:38.360 you wouldn't use them, 00:49:38.500 --> 00:49:39.260 you wouldn't use them, 00:49:39.260 --> 00:49:40.159 they were not credible witnesses, 00:49:40.320 --> 00:49:40.500 correct, 00:49:41.099 --> 00:49:41.440 so, 00:49:41.639 --> 00:49:42.099 and yet, 00:49:42.740 --> 00:49:43.380 that's, 00:49:43.500 --> 00:49:44.220 what we have, 00:49:44.360 --> 00:49:45.440 in all the gospel accounts, 00:49:45.440 --> 00:49:46.400 is, 00:49:46.599 --> 00:49:47.639 that it was the women, 00:49:47.760 --> 00:49:48.420 who followed Jesus, 00:49:48.519 --> 00:49:49.320 who saw them first, 00:49:49.539 --> 00:49:51.139 there is no logical reason, 00:49:51.400 --> 00:49:53.059 to make up that point, 00:49:53.380 --> 00:49:53.960 it makes no, 00:49:54.079 --> 00:49:55.440 it is hurting, 00:49:55.760 --> 00:49:56.340 their argument, 00:49:56.720 --> 00:49:58.000 it is even damning, 00:49:58.220 --> 00:49:58.760 their argument, 00:49:59.119 --> 00:50:00.079 in the ancient world, 00:50:00.579 --> 00:50:02.039 and, 00:50:02.360 --> 00:50:02.740 again, 00:50:03.039 --> 00:50:03.559 scholarship, 00:50:03.880 --> 00:50:04.139 that would, 00:50:04.340 --> 00:50:04.800 that would, 00:50:04.800 --> 00:50:05.840 that would assume, 00:50:05.840 --> 00:50:07.059 that this is a hoax, 00:50:07.480 --> 00:50:08.300 cannot grapple, 00:50:08.440 --> 00:50:09.139 with this point well, 00:50:09.420 --> 00:50:10.300 they cannot grapple, 00:50:10.400 --> 00:50:10.880 with this point well, 00:50:11.139 --> 00:50:11.320 they, 00:50:11.400 --> 00:50:12.119 they of course, 00:50:12.200 --> 00:50:12.820 think that they are, 00:50:12.940 --> 00:50:13.159 and they, 00:50:13.159 --> 00:50:14.619 they carry themselves, 00:50:14.619 --> 00:50:15.199 as if they are, 00:50:15.539 --> 00:50:16.039 but this is, 00:50:16.179 --> 00:50:17.500 this is a problematic point, 00:50:17.579 --> 00:50:17.859 for them, 00:50:19.119 --> 00:50:20.019 and I, 00:50:20.059 --> 00:50:20.319 and I won't, 00:50:20.420 --> 00:50:21.380 the bullet point, 00:50:21.420 --> 00:50:22.219 will give you some, 00:50:22.400 --> 00:50:22.839 some more, 00:50:22.900 --> 00:50:23.880 actual verses, 00:50:24.019 --> 00:50:24.500 look at all, 00:50:24.579 --> 00:50:25.000 and all of the, 00:50:25.079 --> 00:50:26.839 the reason I put that in there, 00:50:26.880 --> 00:50:28.279 is because there are certain stories, 00:50:28.359 --> 00:50:29.000 in the gospels, 00:50:29.139 --> 00:50:30.079 that don't agree, 00:50:30.259 --> 00:50:31.319 among all the other gospels, 00:50:31.380 --> 00:50:32.239 and then other stories, 00:50:32.239 --> 00:50:32.659 that do, 00:50:33.059 --> 00:50:34.519 and all four gospels, 00:50:34.859 --> 00:50:35.480 support, 00:50:35.639 --> 00:50:36.380 and attest to, 00:50:36.960 --> 00:50:38.279 the women being the only people, 00:50:38.639 --> 00:50:40.099 to see Jesus in the tomb, 00:50:40.359 --> 00:50:40.639 again, 00:50:40.799 --> 00:50:41.639 that's important, 00:50:41.639 --> 00:50:42.719 and don't really have time, 00:50:42.759 --> 00:50:43.400 to get into that, 00:50:43.659 --> 00:50:44.659 but if we were doing, 00:50:45.099 --> 00:50:46.460 studying for example, 00:50:46.699 --> 00:50:48.099 variation in the synoptics, 00:50:48.139 --> 00:50:48.859 or something like that, 00:50:49.079 --> 00:50:49.539 we would say, 00:50:49.599 --> 00:50:50.400 well here are the stories, 00:50:50.799 --> 00:50:52.639 that exist in all three, 00:50:52.779 --> 00:50:53.719 of the synoptic gospels, 00:50:53.839 --> 00:50:54.219 and John, 00:50:54.400 --> 00:50:55.259 and here are some stories, 00:50:55.259 --> 00:50:55.739 that don't, 00:50:55.879 --> 00:50:56.960 and then of course, 00:50:57.039 --> 00:50:57.739 scholars jump with that, 00:50:57.799 --> 00:50:57.920 and say, 00:50:58.000 --> 00:50:58.559 oh that didn't, 00:50:58.679 --> 00:50:59.539 you know that couldn't have happened, 00:50:59.599 --> 00:51:00.379 because there's not an agreement, 00:51:00.739 --> 00:51:01.339 well guess what, 00:51:01.400 --> 00:51:02.199 there's an agreement on that, 00:51:02.199 --> 00:51:06.599 yes, 00:51:07.199 --> 00:51:07.939 so, 00:51:08.339 --> 00:51:08.859 we're going to, 00:51:09.239 --> 00:51:10.559 jump out of Bauckham for a minute, 00:51:10.759 --> 00:51:11.460 talk about N.T. Wright, 00:51:11.519 --> 00:51:11.960 real quickly, 00:51:12.819 --> 00:51:14.079 so as I said, 00:51:14.119 --> 00:51:14.500 N.T. Wright, 00:51:14.779 --> 00:51:15.899 really doesn't focus, 00:51:15.899 --> 00:51:17.079 on one area, 00:51:17.659 --> 00:51:17.699 of, 00:51:17.699 --> 00:51:18.439 of, 00:51:18.439 --> 00:51:19.799 of second temple history, 00:51:20.000 --> 00:51:20.419 of the history, 00:51:20.519 --> 00:51:21.000 of the resurrection, 00:51:21.159 --> 00:51:22.059 of the historicity of Jesus, 00:51:22.399 --> 00:51:23.000 he really, 00:51:23.419 --> 00:51:23.859 this is, 00:51:24.259 --> 00:51:24.699 you know, 00:51:24.759 --> 00:51:26.679 the font is very small, 00:51:27.139 --> 00:51:27.759 and this is, 00:51:29.159 --> 00:51:30.239 and in the previous volume, 00:51:30.359 --> 00:51:31.219 it was fatter than this, 00:51:31.259 --> 00:51:32.000 and he was talking about, 00:51:32.000 --> 00:51:32.159 again, 00:51:32.199 --> 00:51:32.900 Jesus's ministry, 00:51:33.340 --> 00:51:33.579 so, 00:51:33.920 --> 00:51:36.119 Wright does an unbelievable job, 00:51:36.320 --> 00:51:36.659 treating, 00:51:37.139 --> 00:51:38.519 treating, 00:51:39.159 --> 00:51:40.000 the historicity, 00:51:40.119 --> 00:51:41.099 the historical accuracy, 00:51:41.239 --> 00:51:41.679 and reliability, 00:51:41.679 --> 00:51:42.440 of the resurrection, 00:51:43.119 --> 00:51:44.440 and there are a couple, 00:51:44.639 --> 00:51:45.579 kind of key points, 00:51:45.659 --> 00:51:46.039 that he makes, 00:51:46.239 --> 00:51:46.800 that I think, 00:51:46.800 --> 00:51:47.559 I think is good for us, 00:51:47.579 --> 00:51:47.960 to know about, 00:51:48.599 --> 00:51:50.780 so Christian theology, 00:51:51.480 --> 00:51:52.900 of the afterlife, 00:51:53.119 --> 00:51:54.539 mutates from multiple views, 00:51:54.599 --> 00:51:54.980 in Judaism, 00:51:55.460 --> 00:51:56.000 so this is, 00:51:56.280 --> 00:51:57.519 I wrote this a little bit differently, 00:51:57.940 --> 00:51:58.360 it's sort of, 00:51:58.440 --> 00:51:59.480 N.T. Wright basically says, 00:51:59.940 --> 00:52:01.539 after Jesus died, 00:52:02.000 --> 00:52:03.579 let's just assume for a minute, 00:52:03.719 --> 00:52:04.739 that he wasn't raised from the dead, 00:52:04.780 --> 00:52:05.420 we know that he lived, 00:52:05.480 --> 00:52:06.139 we know that he died, 00:52:06.440 --> 00:52:07.360 now we're asking the question, 00:52:07.480 --> 00:52:08.800 did he really rise from the dead, 00:52:09.039 --> 00:52:10.099 let's look at, 00:52:10.679 --> 00:52:11.780 where this happens, 00:52:11.820 --> 00:52:12.679 or that happened in Israel, 00:52:13.199 --> 00:52:14.380 his followers were Israelites, 00:52:14.739 --> 00:52:15.739 let's look at the things, 00:52:15.739 --> 00:52:16.800 that they believed, 00:52:17.159 --> 00:52:18.940 before Jesus's death, 00:52:19.219 --> 00:52:20.000 and then what, 00:52:20.159 --> 00:52:21.059 we know that they believed, 00:52:21.139 --> 00:52:22.019 after Jesus's death, 00:52:22.059 --> 00:52:22.780 because we have, 00:52:23.039 --> 00:52:23.579 the Bible, 00:52:23.699 --> 00:52:24.739 we have these written works, 00:52:24.739 --> 00:52:25.500 we have these traditions, 00:52:25.500 --> 00:52:26.139 that were preserved, 00:52:26.459 --> 00:52:27.359 and they represent, 00:52:27.559 --> 00:52:28.500 what people were saying, 00:52:28.579 --> 00:52:29.000 and believing, 00:52:29.319 --> 00:52:30.019 and so what right now, 00:52:30.079 --> 00:52:30.759 is going to be a little bit, 00:52:30.759 --> 00:52:31.500 of a laundry list of, 00:52:31.879 --> 00:52:32.279 radical, 00:52:32.459 --> 00:52:33.039 a radical, 00:52:33.339 --> 00:52:34.099 radically different, 00:52:34.319 --> 00:52:35.379 understanding of, 00:52:35.799 --> 00:52:36.119 of, 00:52:36.119 --> 00:52:37.199 of themselves, 00:52:37.459 --> 00:52:38.299 of what they believe, 00:52:38.759 --> 00:52:39.799 of what they think about life, 00:52:39.899 --> 00:52:40.059 so, 00:52:40.439 --> 00:52:41.979 the theology of the afterlife, 00:52:42.539 --> 00:52:44.000 completely different, 00:52:44.799 --> 00:52:46.019 before, 00:52:46.279 --> 00:52:47.659 before Jesus's death, 00:52:47.839 --> 00:52:48.419 and after, 00:52:48.879 --> 00:52:50.199 where in Jewish thought, 00:52:50.199 --> 00:52:52.199 the Pharisees, 00:52:52.259 --> 00:52:53.179 thought something very different, 00:52:53.339 --> 00:52:54.159 from the Sadducees, 00:52:54.259 --> 00:52:55.519 which thought something very different, 00:52:55.699 --> 00:52:56.379 from the Essenes, 00:52:56.460 --> 00:52:57.299 which thought something different, 00:52:57.439 --> 00:52:59.480 from the average Jewish person, 00:52:59.980 --> 00:53:00.719 and you have, 00:53:01.079 --> 00:53:01.099 of course, 00:53:01.299 --> 00:53:02.439 those that didn't follow Jesus, 00:53:02.559 --> 00:53:03.379 continued in that, 00:53:03.779 --> 00:53:04.439 those variations, 00:53:04.899 --> 00:53:05.319 but yet, 00:53:05.599 --> 00:53:06.519 after the resurrection, 00:53:06.939 --> 00:53:08.199 there's now this large contingent, 00:53:08.399 --> 00:53:09.659 which has this very focused, 00:53:09.739 --> 00:53:10.259 and defined, 00:53:10.619 --> 00:53:11.559 view of the afterlife, 00:53:11.739 --> 00:53:12.759 which is very different, 00:53:12.879 --> 00:53:13.839 from what it was before, 00:53:14.839 --> 00:53:15.039 right, 00:53:15.099 --> 00:53:15.799 is asking the question, 00:53:15.960 --> 00:53:16.980 how do you explain that, 00:53:17.039 --> 00:53:18.019 if there is no resurrection, 00:53:18.019 --> 00:53:22.719 the importance of the resurrection, 00:53:22.960 --> 00:53:23.579 as a whole, 00:53:23.699 --> 00:53:24.500 completely changes, 00:53:25.099 --> 00:53:25.539 again, 00:53:25.840 --> 00:53:26.300 so, 00:53:26.400 --> 00:53:26.739 for example, 00:53:26.900 --> 00:53:27.619 Jesus often, 00:53:27.980 --> 00:53:29.079 talks to the Pharisees, 00:53:29.159 --> 00:53:30.079 sometimes to the Sadducees, 00:53:30.159 --> 00:53:31.059 a lot of people don't know this, 00:53:31.480 --> 00:53:32.119 Pharisees, 00:53:32.340 --> 00:53:32.860 even though they're, 00:53:33.340 --> 00:53:34.699 painted as the bad guys, 00:53:34.900 --> 00:53:35.719 in the gospels, 00:53:36.119 --> 00:53:36.480 really, 00:53:36.880 --> 00:53:37.440 theologically, 00:53:37.659 --> 00:53:37.860 fell, 00:53:38.119 --> 00:53:38.800 fell, 00:53:39.019 --> 00:53:40.239 closer to, 00:53:40.380 --> 00:53:41.259 to what we, 00:53:41.360 --> 00:53:42.400 to what we would understand, 00:53:42.480 --> 00:53:42.940 theologically, 00:53:43.360 --> 00:53:44.679 the Pharisees believed, 00:53:44.800 --> 00:53:45.599 in a bodily resurrection, 00:53:45.739 --> 00:53:46.280 were looking forward, 00:53:46.400 --> 00:53:47.400 to a bodily resurrection, 00:53:47.400 --> 00:53:48.360 the Sadducees, 00:53:48.480 --> 00:53:49.119 did not, 00:53:49.400 --> 00:53:49.860 for example, 00:53:50.539 --> 00:53:53.220 the timing of the resurrection, 00:53:53.360 --> 00:53:54.380 changes from judgment, 00:53:54.619 --> 00:53:55.559 so the expectation, 00:53:55.760 --> 00:53:56.619 of when this resurrection, 00:53:56.820 --> 00:53:57.119 will occur, 00:53:57.500 --> 00:53:57.940 changes, 00:53:58.260 --> 00:53:59.019 radically, 00:53:59.220 --> 00:53:59.840 to where we think, 00:53:59.980 --> 00:54:01.760 that there will be one resurrection, 00:54:02.300 --> 00:54:03.039 at the end, 00:54:03.340 --> 00:54:03.820 all of a sudden, 00:54:03.960 --> 00:54:04.320 people are, 00:54:04.440 --> 00:54:05.099 start talking about, 00:54:05.180 --> 00:54:05.700 Paul talks about, 00:54:05.780 --> 00:54:06.760 first Corinthians, 00:54:07.400 --> 00:54:08.940 Jesus already being raised, 00:54:09.019 --> 00:54:10.079 and us being raised with him, 00:54:10.099 --> 00:54:11.139 and he being the first fruits, 00:54:11.800 --> 00:54:12.860 why was he saying this, 00:54:12.900 --> 00:54:13.740 this is very different, 00:54:13.860 --> 00:54:14.260 this is not, 00:54:14.440 --> 00:54:15.579 this is radically different, 00:54:15.579 --> 00:54:16.039 from anything, 00:54:16.039 --> 00:54:17.900 that in Jewish literature, 00:54:18.059 --> 00:54:18.619 you can find, 00:54:18.679 --> 00:54:19.199 in the Old Testament, 00:54:19.320 --> 00:54:19.920 this is different, 00:54:20.699 --> 00:54:24.840 if the early Christian church, 00:54:24.900 --> 00:54:25.579 wanted to communicate, 00:54:25.779 --> 00:54:26.800 that Jesus was special, 00:54:26.980 --> 00:54:28.059 despite his shameful death, 00:54:28.099 --> 00:54:28.639 on the cross, 00:54:29.019 --> 00:54:29.619 they would have made up, 00:54:29.659 --> 00:54:30.739 a story using existing, 00:54:30.900 --> 00:54:31.759 Jewish concepts, 00:54:31.960 --> 00:54:32.579 of exaltation, 00:54:32.679 --> 00:54:32.800 so, 00:54:32.940 --> 00:54:33.639 and T. Wright points out, 00:54:34.039 --> 00:54:35.219 that there was already, 00:54:35.279 --> 00:54:35.800 a tradition, 00:54:36.199 --> 00:54:36.420 of, 00:54:36.420 --> 00:54:36.759 of, 00:54:36.759 --> 00:54:37.380 of, 00:54:37.380 --> 00:54:39.259 of exalting, 00:54:39.380 --> 00:54:39.880 and honoring, 00:54:40.279 --> 00:54:41.320 figures, 00:54:41.320 --> 00:54:41.960 who had, 00:54:42.079 --> 00:54:43.099 had died, 00:54:43.099 --> 00:54:43.519 and passed, 00:54:43.960 --> 00:54:45.019 and were gone, 00:54:45.259 --> 00:54:45.400 but, 00:54:45.940 --> 00:54:46.339 that's not, 00:54:46.420 --> 00:54:47.259 what goes on with Jesus, 00:54:47.500 --> 00:54:48.440 they're speaking about him, 00:54:48.500 --> 00:54:48.759 differently, 00:54:48.880 --> 00:54:49.719 they're speaking about him, 00:54:49.759 --> 00:54:50.500 as though he is alive, 00:54:50.559 --> 00:54:51.199 he's been raised, 00:54:51.500 --> 00:54:52.159 he's reigning, 00:54:52.460 --> 00:54:53.239 he's our Lord, 00:54:53.659 --> 00:54:54.500 this is novel, 00:54:54.599 --> 00:54:55.199 this is new, 00:54:55.400 --> 00:54:56.179 this is not something, 00:54:56.299 --> 00:54:56.400 that, 00:54:56.519 --> 00:54:57.500 this is not something, 00:54:57.559 --> 00:54:58.360 that has existed, 00:54:58.739 --> 00:54:59.299 with Elijah, 00:54:59.440 --> 00:54:59.900 or with any of these, 00:54:59.940 --> 00:55:00.440 other figures, 00:55:00.440 --> 00:55:03.900 the early church, 00:55:03.940 --> 00:55:05.000 became extremely reckless, 00:55:05.000 --> 00:55:05.679 about sickness, 00:55:05.920 --> 00:55:06.380 and death, 00:55:06.539 --> 00:55:06.980 and the way, 00:55:07.079 --> 00:55:07.940 that they do ministry, 00:55:08.519 --> 00:55:09.900 they were taking care of people, 00:55:10.019 --> 00:55:10.980 with communicable diseases, 00:55:11.200 --> 00:55:12.340 and testifying about their faith, 00:55:12.380 --> 00:55:13.159 in the face of torture, 00:55:13.200 --> 00:55:13.760 and execution, 00:55:14.360 --> 00:55:15.019 most Christians, 00:55:15.159 --> 00:55:15.760 are familiar, 00:55:15.960 --> 00:55:16.460 with the, 00:55:16.460 --> 00:55:17.420 persecution, 00:55:18.079 --> 00:55:19.460 that the early church, 00:55:19.579 --> 00:55:20.360 went through, 00:55:20.679 --> 00:55:22.780 in both the local area, 00:55:22.860 --> 00:55:24.280 and in all the Roman provinces, 00:55:24.980 --> 00:55:26.380 if the resurrection, 00:55:26.519 --> 00:55:27.039 never happened, 00:55:27.440 --> 00:55:28.539 if this is just a hoax, 00:55:28.880 --> 00:55:29.980 why were people dying, 00:55:29.980 --> 00:55:30.599 for a hoax, 00:55:31.039 --> 00:55:32.000 why were people, 00:55:32.099 --> 00:55:33.699 ministering to leper colonies, 00:55:34.219 --> 00:55:35.000 why were people, 00:55:35.139 --> 00:55:36.719 risking disease, 00:55:36.980 --> 00:55:37.619 and death, 00:55:37.800 --> 00:55:38.420 and torture, 00:55:38.920 --> 00:55:39.920 if this was just, 00:55:40.019 --> 00:55:41.099 a made up story, 00:55:41.579 --> 00:55:43.099 what could cause people, 00:55:43.699 --> 00:55:44.860 within a few years, 00:55:45.159 --> 00:55:46.539 to be willing to, 00:55:46.619 --> 00:55:48.159 to die for their faith, 00:55:48.760 --> 00:55:49.360 because we know, 00:55:49.440 --> 00:55:50.240 that the Roman empire, 00:55:50.599 --> 00:55:51.880 almost always offered them, 00:55:51.920 --> 00:55:52.639 I actually have water, 00:55:52.719 --> 00:55:53.039 thank you, 00:55:53.420 --> 00:55:55.199 we know that they offered them, 00:55:55.240 --> 00:55:55.760 a way out, 00:55:55.940 --> 00:55:57.280 there wasn't a zero sum game, 00:55:57.400 --> 00:55:58.699 they almost were always offered, 00:55:59.039 --> 00:55:59.079 the, 00:55:59.079 --> 00:55:59.960 the, 00:55:59.960 --> 00:56:00.579 the opportunity, 00:56:00.940 --> 00:56:01.639 to recant, 00:56:02.000 --> 00:56:03.159 their faith in Jesus, 00:56:03.619 --> 00:56:04.760 and that's something, 00:56:04.880 --> 00:56:05.559 that's carried through, 00:56:05.619 --> 00:56:06.099 through the centuries, 00:56:06.240 --> 00:56:07.920 but it started back then, 00:56:08.800 --> 00:56:09.860 they didn't recant, 00:56:10.340 --> 00:56:10.539 you know, 00:56:10.579 --> 00:56:10.860 they didn't, 00:56:11.039 --> 00:56:12.280 and why didn't they do that, 00:56:12.800 --> 00:56:13.380 think about it, 00:56:13.400 --> 00:56:14.179 if you're in that position, 00:56:14.980 --> 00:56:15.679 even if you're a follower, 00:56:15.780 --> 00:56:15.940 I mean, 00:56:15.980 --> 00:56:16.740 I think about it today, 00:56:17.440 --> 00:56:18.360 I love Jesus, 00:56:18.480 --> 00:56:19.340 I think he knows that, 00:56:19.380 --> 00:56:20.320 if somebody had a gun, 00:56:20.360 --> 00:56:21.119 to my family's head, 00:56:21.760 --> 00:56:22.400 I might say, 00:56:22.460 --> 00:56:22.820 you know what, 00:56:22.840 --> 00:56:24.260 I'm just gonna recant to them, 00:56:24.420 --> 00:56:24.539 but, 00:56:24.940 --> 00:56:25.500 in my heart, 00:56:25.539 --> 00:56:26.300 I don't really mean it, 00:56:26.360 --> 00:56:27.039 God knows that, 00:56:27.119 --> 00:56:27.280 right, 00:56:27.740 --> 00:56:28.500 they didn't do that, 00:56:29.040 --> 00:56:29.800 they didn't do that, 00:56:29.940 --> 00:56:31.040 why didn't they do that, 00:56:31.300 --> 00:56:31.980 because it was, 00:56:32.100 --> 00:56:32.260 yes, 00:56:32.519 --> 00:56:33.180 did you have a question, 00:56:33.320 --> 00:56:33.540 I'm sorry, 00:56:33.880 --> 00:56:34.080 okay, 00:56:34.800 --> 00:56:35.580 they didn't do that, 00:56:35.620 --> 00:56:37.840 because they believed it to be real, 00:56:38.040 --> 00:56:39.519 how do you get a group of people, 00:56:39.519 --> 00:56:40.040 to believe, 00:56:40.220 --> 00:56:41.080 that that is real, 00:56:41.160 --> 00:56:41.980 if it's not true, 00:56:41.980 --> 00:56:42.340 yes, 00:56:42.760 --> 00:56:53.159 it's true, 00:56:53.159 --> 00:56:53.199 it's true, 00:56:53.199 --> 00:56:55.320 but, 00:56:56.360 --> 00:56:57.800 Peter was martyred, 00:56:58.240 --> 00:56:59.139 James was martyred, 00:56:59.519 --> 00:57:00.840 John spent his life in prison, 00:57:01.179 --> 00:57:02.340 if it was a hoax, 00:57:02.980 --> 00:57:04.740 it was a hoax that they created, 00:57:05.519 --> 00:57:06.860 so it wasn't possible, 00:57:07.139 --> 00:57:07.360 but then, 00:57:07.480 --> 00:57:08.740 I always draw that distinction, 00:57:08.739 --> 00:57:11.619 between the martyrdom of the eyewitnesses, 00:57:11.879 --> 00:57:13.799 and the martyrdom of everybody else, 00:57:13.939 --> 00:57:16.459 because everybody else is at least theoretically possible, 00:57:16.579 --> 00:57:17.239 if they were deceived, 00:57:17.559 --> 00:57:18.659 those guys saw it, 00:57:18.719 --> 00:57:19.279 it was a hoax, 00:57:19.319 --> 00:57:20.000 it was their hoax, 00:57:20.000 --> 00:57:20.460 correct, 00:57:20.940 --> 00:57:21.639 and, 00:57:21.880 --> 00:57:22.480 you know, 00:57:22.559 --> 00:57:23.380 you say, 00:57:23.559 --> 00:57:23.780 you know, 00:57:23.800 --> 00:57:25.000 we have some examples of people, 00:57:25.239 --> 00:57:26.280 Jonestown, 00:57:26.440 --> 00:57:26.619 and, 00:57:26.739 --> 00:57:28.159 certain cults, 00:57:28.659 --> 00:57:28.920 you say, 00:57:29.000 --> 00:57:29.099 well, 00:57:29.219 --> 00:57:30.219 that's possible, 00:57:30.539 --> 00:57:30.880 again, 00:57:31.440 --> 00:57:33.280 when you're comparing the scale, 00:57:33.400 --> 00:57:34.500 of those instances, 00:57:35.059 --> 00:57:36.000 it's minuscule, 00:57:36.380 --> 00:57:36.860 to, 00:57:37.380 --> 00:57:37.960 a faith, 00:57:38.500 --> 00:57:38.780 that, 00:57:38.860 --> 00:57:39.500 that, 00:57:39.500 --> 00:57:39.880 that, 00:57:39.880 --> 00:57:40.239 that, 00:57:40.239 --> 00:57:41.480 that explodes, 00:57:41.579 --> 00:57:42.820 across a community, 00:57:43.000 --> 00:57:43.300 that has, 00:57:43.400 --> 00:57:44.539 as we're going to see in the last section, 00:57:44.619 --> 00:57:45.380 that's why I'm ending on it, 00:57:45.400 --> 00:57:46.739 a very defined, 00:57:47.260 --> 00:57:47.659 faith, 00:57:48.099 --> 00:57:50.659 so this isn't a group of 20 or 30 people, 00:57:50.819 --> 00:57:50.839 that, 00:57:50.940 --> 00:57:51.099 you know, 00:57:51.139 --> 00:57:52.079 a cult of 20 or 30, 00:57:52.119 --> 00:57:53.039 or even 100 or 200, 00:57:53.099 --> 00:57:54.199 a few hundred like Jonestown was, 00:57:54.559 --> 00:57:56.579 this is a widespread faith, 00:57:56.639 --> 00:57:57.279 that is growing, 00:57:57.579 --> 00:57:58.219 among people, 00:57:58.319 --> 00:57:59.119 in a joyous way, 00:57:59.179 --> 00:58:00.460 that they're going out into the communities, 00:58:00.599 --> 00:58:01.759 that they're affecting their communities, 00:58:02.079 --> 00:58:03.579 they're ministering to people, 00:58:03.659 --> 00:58:04.500 they're feeding people, 00:58:04.599 --> 00:58:05.319 they're loving people, 00:58:05.440 --> 00:58:05.579 again, 00:58:05.659 --> 00:58:06.159 this wasn't a, 00:58:06.159 --> 00:58:08.339 the early church wasn't cloistered, 00:58:08.379 --> 00:58:09.319 so much as it is today, 00:58:09.639 --> 00:58:11.319 that this was a movement, 00:58:11.719 --> 00:58:11.759 that, 00:58:12.139 --> 00:58:13.279 and I don't talk about it, 00:58:13.359 --> 00:58:13.519 but, 00:58:13.839 --> 00:58:14.659 Tacitus, 00:58:14.899 --> 00:58:15.079 and, 00:58:15.079 --> 00:58:15.480 and different, 00:58:15.639 --> 00:58:16.619 we have written, 00:58:16.619 --> 00:58:19.339 recollections from certain Roman officials, 00:58:19.779 --> 00:58:20.159 emperors, 00:58:20.359 --> 00:58:21.000 historians, 00:58:21.440 --> 00:58:21.639 oh, 00:58:21.799 --> 00:58:22.079 you know, 00:58:22.139 --> 00:58:23.460 those gosh darn Christians, 00:58:23.639 --> 00:58:24.559 are such an annoyance, 00:58:24.839 --> 00:58:26.199 and no matter what we seem to do to them, 00:58:26.339 --> 00:58:26.539 you know, 00:58:26.559 --> 00:58:27.239 they don't stop, 00:58:27.380 --> 00:58:27.500 and, 00:58:27.900 --> 00:58:30.359 I could have spent some time talking about that, 00:58:30.500 --> 00:58:32.259 it's not that pertinent to the resurrection, 00:58:32.400 --> 00:58:33.299 which is why I didn't include it, 00:58:33.539 --> 00:58:33.920 but again, 00:58:33.960 --> 00:58:35.460 that's just more historical evidence, 00:58:35.859 --> 00:58:36.980 where you have a Roman, 00:58:37.460 --> 00:58:38.219 you know, 00:58:38.579 --> 00:58:39.960 prefect writing a letter, 00:58:40.339 --> 00:58:41.159 to the emperor saying, 00:58:41.159 --> 00:58:42.039 I don't know what to do with these, 00:58:42.119 --> 00:58:42.319 you know, 00:58:42.359 --> 00:58:43.199 these gosh darn Christians, 00:58:43.920 --> 00:58:44.099 you know, 00:58:44.099 --> 00:58:44.539 and so, 00:58:44.779 --> 00:58:45.000 again, 00:58:45.139 --> 00:58:45.299 all, 00:58:45.399 --> 00:58:45.839 this is all, 00:58:46.000 --> 00:58:46.799 it's all evidence, 00:58:48.179 --> 00:58:48.460 um, 00:58:48.759 --> 00:58:50.079 uh, 00:58:50.079 --> 00:58:50.659 the gospels, 00:58:50.779 --> 00:58:51.059 especially, 00:58:51.259 --> 00:58:51.339 and, 00:58:51.460 --> 00:58:53.079 I mention this because, 00:58:53.639 --> 00:58:54.679 even though I talked about it earlier, 00:58:54.879 --> 00:58:55.019 right, 00:58:55.420 --> 00:58:55.799 uh, 00:58:55.799 --> 00:58:57.679 definitely gives Mark a lot of treatment, 00:58:57.980 --> 00:58:59.920 talking about the simplicity of Mark, 00:58:59.940 --> 00:59:02.299 and how that aligns with an historically accurate account, 00:59:02.300 --> 00:59:04.440 no embellishment, 00:59:04.640 --> 00:59:05.480 no time for, 00:59:05.780 --> 00:59:06.039 you know, 00:59:06.039 --> 00:59:06.480 sort of, 00:59:06.519 --> 00:59:07.200 a literary, 00:59:07.400 --> 00:59:07.660 uh, 00:59:07.660 --> 00:59:08.280 um, 00:59:08.580 --> 00:59:09.380 tradition of, 00:59:09.380 --> 00:59:09.680 of, 00:59:09.680 --> 00:59:10.760 of embellishment, 00:59:10.880 --> 00:59:11.880 and fantastical kind of, 00:59:11.900 --> 00:59:12.200 uh, 00:59:12.200 --> 00:59:13.360 details to emerge, 00:59:13.360 --> 00:59:14.280 um, 00:59:14.360 --> 00:59:15.660 and Wright does, 00:59:15.800 --> 00:59:16.019 again, 00:59:16.180 --> 00:59:19.820 spend a lot of time on the story of the women who were the first witnesses to the empty tomb, 00:59:20.200 --> 00:59:23.539 cannot have been invented because the testimony of women was inadmissible under all those, 00:59:23.700 --> 00:59:24.360 almost all, 00:59:24.440 --> 00:59:24.640 uh, 00:59:24.640 --> 00:59:25.039 circumstances. 00:59:25.640 --> 00:59:29.039 So Wright does an excellent job of painting a picture of, 00:59:29.900 --> 00:59:30.260 uh, 00:59:30.440 --> 00:59:31.100 of a culture, 00:59:31.200 --> 00:59:31.980 of an entire culture, 00:59:32.300 --> 00:59:33.780 that looked a certain way, 00:59:34.320 --> 00:59:35.300 believed a certain thing, 00:59:35.300 --> 00:59:36.539 uh, 00:59:36.580 --> 00:59:38.200 and then within a span of a few years, 00:59:38.420 --> 00:59:39.560 looks radically different, 00:59:39.680 --> 00:59:40.800 believes something radically different, 00:59:41.120 --> 00:59:42.580 and then he raises a question, 00:59:42.740 --> 00:59:44.700 how do you get a culture to do this? 00:59:44.740 --> 00:59:49.160 How do you get something like this to transform if there isn't an empty tomb? 00:59:49.620 --> 00:59:51.740 If there weren't people who are saying, 00:59:51.880 --> 00:59:52.880 I saw him alive, 00:59:53.140 --> 00:59:54.680 and I really believe it, 00:59:54.780 --> 00:59:56.480 I really mean what I say, 00:59:57.080 --> 00:59:57.400 uh, 00:59:57.460 --> 00:59:57.660 right, 00:59:58.100 --> 00:59:59.140 like Bauckham argues, 00:59:59.300 --> 00:59:59.440 you, 00:59:59.640 --> 01:00:01.220 you can't get there, 01:00:01.260 --> 01:00:01.380 we, 01:00:01.380 --> 01:00:01.880 I cannot, 01:00:02.220 --> 01:00:02.380 as, 01:00:02.460 --> 01:00:02.640 as, 01:00:02.640 --> 01:00:03.400 as a historian, 01:00:03.400 --> 01:00:07.099 I cannot tell you in good faith that I can explain this to you, 01:00:07.099 --> 01:00:07.660 uh, 01:00:07.700 --> 01:00:08.059 if the, 01:00:08.059 --> 01:00:08.380 if the, 01:00:08.380 --> 01:00:08.800 if the, 01:00:08.800 --> 01:00:10.340 if the resurrection didn't really happen, 01:00:10.400 --> 01:00:11.480 if people didn't really believe this. 01:00:12.160 --> 01:00:13.099 And we are running out of time, 01:00:13.160 --> 01:00:14.579 but I do want to tell you about Larry Hurtado, 01:00:14.660 --> 01:00:16.320 because I think his scholarship is excellent, 01:00:16.780 --> 01:00:19.559 and I think that this is a really important point, 01:00:19.680 --> 01:00:20.300 uh, 01:00:20.340 --> 01:00:22.680 in your ability to kind of understand the resurrection, 01:00:22.840 --> 01:00:24.280 and understand why we believe it to be true. 01:00:24.280 --> 01:00:25.080 Um, 01:00:25.360 --> 01:00:26.240 so, 01:00:26.320 --> 01:00:26.720 Hurtado, 01:00:26.720 --> 01:00:27.660 uh, 01:00:27.660 --> 01:00:29.460 scholarship focuses on, 01:00:29.460 --> 01:00:30.340 uh, 01:00:31.000 --> 01:00:31.340 Christ, 01:00:31.420 --> 01:00:31.740 the Christ, 01:00:31.880 --> 01:00:32.300 uh, 01:00:32.300 --> 01:00:33.019 Christology, 01:00:33.120 --> 01:00:34.060 and early Christology, 01:00:34.100 --> 01:00:34.960 and a high Christology. 01:00:35.120 --> 01:00:35.420 So again, 01:00:35.440 --> 01:00:37.280 I explained to you earlier that Christology, 01:00:37.400 --> 01:00:40.080 high Christology means that there was an early, 01:00:40.080 --> 01:00:40.840 and, 01:00:40.880 --> 01:00:41.220 and, 01:00:41.220 --> 01:00:41.600 and, 01:00:41.600 --> 01:00:46.560 and significant belief that Jesus was divine, 01:00:46.680 --> 01:00:47.900 that Jesus was Lord, 01:00:48.080 --> 01:00:49.519 that he was worshiped as Lord, 01:00:49.519 --> 01:00:51.820 that he wasn't seen as, 01:00:52.000 --> 01:00:52.280 uh, 01:00:52.420 --> 01:00:52.820 just a, 01:00:52.820 --> 01:00:53.699 a nice guy, 01:00:54.239 --> 01:00:54.519 uh, 01:00:54.519 --> 01:00:55.000 uh, 01:00:55.000 --> 01:00:57.400 a traveling sage, 01:00:57.860 --> 01:00:58.199 uh, 01:00:58.239 --> 01:00:58.400 that, 01:00:58.460 --> 01:00:59.860 that he wasn't talked about that way. 01:01:00.239 --> 01:01:00.639 Early, 01:01:00.880 --> 01:01:01.920 high Christology, 01:01:02.320 --> 01:01:02.639 early, 01:01:02.800 --> 01:01:04.719 high acknowledgement of Jesus as Messiah, 01:01:05.159 --> 01:01:05.940 Jesus as Lord, 01:01:06.360 --> 01:01:08.800 and of this idea of by theism. 01:01:09.000 --> 01:01:10.840 And I'll talk a little bit about that really quickly, 01:01:10.900 --> 01:01:11.340 and then we'll end. 01:01:11.739 --> 01:01:12.019 So, 01:01:12.119 --> 01:01:12.320 uh, 01:01:12.360 --> 01:01:13.539 there's a thing in, 01:01:13.579 --> 01:01:14.719 in Judaism called the Shema, 01:01:15.659 --> 01:01:16.780 and I won't read that to you, 01:01:16.900 --> 01:01:18.880 but this is the Shema in Hebrew, 01:01:18.880 --> 01:01:20.539 and what it translates to is, 01:01:20.619 --> 01:01:20.760 hear, 01:01:20.880 --> 01:01:21.320 O Israel, 01:01:21.400 --> 01:01:22.380 the Lord is our God, 01:01:22.440 --> 01:01:23.559 the Lord is one. 01:01:24.460 --> 01:01:29.740 The Shema forms the backbone of Jewish identity for a thousand years. 01:01:32.320 --> 01:01:33.740 Judaism is fiercely, 01:01:34.660 --> 01:01:35.740 fiercely monotheistic. 01:01:37.019 --> 01:01:40.039 This is what you see when you look at the Exodus, 01:01:40.440 --> 01:01:41.840 when you read through the Old Testament, 01:01:42.460 --> 01:01:42.760 Exodus, 01:01:43.380 --> 01:01:43.840 exile, 01:01:44.240 --> 01:01:44.800 so on and so forth, 01:01:44.820 --> 01:01:48.700 the entire identity of a people who went through a thousand years of trial and tribulation, 01:01:48.880 --> 01:01:52.920 their entire identity is built on this idea that God is one. 01:01:53.039 --> 01:01:53.780 There is one God. 01:01:54.640 --> 01:01:54.820 And, 01:01:54.880 --> 01:01:55.160 and, 01:01:55.160 --> 01:02:01.180 and that is sort of amplified by the fact that Israel was for all that time surrounded by nations. 01:02:01.280 --> 01:02:02.140 It didn't have, 01:02:02.140 --> 01:02:02.940 uh, 01:02:03.039 --> 01:02:03.539 uh, 01:02:03.619 --> 01:02:03.880 uh, 01:02:03.880 --> 01:02:04.300 another, 01:02:04.440 --> 01:02:05.119 uh, 01:02:05.119 --> 01:02:06.180 form of monotheism. 01:02:06.619 --> 01:02:07.440 Overwhelmingly pagan. 01:02:07.579 --> 01:02:08.820 This is Samaritans a little bit. 01:02:08.880 --> 01:02:10.579 The Samaritans had something very close to monotheism, 01:02:10.700 --> 01:02:11.579 but for the most part, 01:02:11.619 --> 01:02:12.660 it's overwhelmingly pagan. 01:02:13.460 --> 01:02:15.539 The monotheism of Israel is fiercely held, 01:02:15.980 --> 01:02:18.859 regionally unique and defining and historically untarnished. 01:02:18.960 --> 01:02:22.739 There wasn't a point in Israel's history where they ever compromised on this point. 01:02:23.019 --> 01:02:24.359 For a thousand years, 01:02:24.420 --> 01:02:25.920 it did not compromise on this point, 01:02:26.019 --> 01:02:26.399 obviously. 01:02:26.679 --> 01:02:26.920 I mean, 01:02:26.920 --> 01:02:27.699 you could go back to, 01:02:27.759 --> 01:02:27.899 you know, 01:02:27.899 --> 01:02:28.699 where they chose to, 01:02:28.699 --> 01:02:29.059 uh, 01:02:29.059 --> 01:02:29.920 worship the calf, 01:02:30.099 --> 01:02:31.719 right after Moses, 01:02:31.859 --> 01:02:32.039 you know, 01:02:32.039 --> 01:02:32.659 takes him out of Egypt. 01:02:32.980 --> 01:02:34.500 But in between those two points, 01:02:34.579 --> 01:02:34.899 this is, 01:02:34.980 --> 01:02:35.339 this is, 01:02:35.460 --> 01:02:37.079 this is one thing that holds true. 01:02:37.079 --> 01:02:38.259 Um, 01:02:39.019 --> 01:02:43.460 and the earliest Christian communities arising primarily after, 01:02:43.679 --> 01:02:45.539 so Peter gives a sermon on the Pentecost. 01:02:46.059 --> 01:02:46.500 Um, 01:02:46.799 --> 01:02:51.179 these earliest Christian communities are Jewish in composition. 01:02:51.179 --> 01:02:52.440 This is something I mentioned earlier, 01:02:52.440 --> 01:02:53.500 and this is hugely important. 01:02:53.799 --> 01:02:54.860 They're Jewish in composition, 01:02:54.980 --> 01:02:57.739 being made up of mostly native Israelites in and around Jerusalem, 01:02:57.739 --> 01:03:00.219 as well as diaspora Jews, 01:03:00.360 --> 01:03:01.079 diaspora Hebrews. 01:03:01.239 --> 01:03:02.380 Diaspora means, 01:03:02.380 --> 01:03:02.799 uh, 01:03:02.840 --> 01:03:03.000 the, 01:03:03.000 --> 01:03:03.539 the, 01:03:03.539 --> 01:03:03.699 the, 01:03:03.699 --> 01:03:03.799 the, 01:03:03.799 --> 01:03:04.299 the, 01:03:04.299 --> 01:03:05.119 the out gathering. 01:03:05.380 --> 01:03:07.059 It means that the Jewish people, 01:03:07.079 --> 01:03:08.519 who were culturally Jewish, 01:03:08.519 --> 01:03:09.319 uh, 01:03:09.519 --> 01:03:13.179 that were living in places other than in and around Jerusalem and Israel itself, 01:03:13.179 --> 01:03:15.000 they had traveled out and were living in other places, 01:03:15.000 --> 01:03:17.259 but they observed Torah. 01:03:17.599 --> 01:03:19.299 They observed the laws, 01:03:19.400 --> 01:03:19.900 they observed, 01:03:19.900 --> 01:03:21.880 observed the eating laws, 01:03:21.940 --> 01:03:22.340 they observed, 01:03:22.340 --> 01:03:23.380 observed the festivals. 01:03:23.539 --> 01:03:25.299 They would be traveling back. 01:03:25.380 --> 01:03:26.840 That's how they would have heard Peter's sermon. 01:03:26.980 --> 01:03:28.699 They travel back to the temple. 01:03:28.699 --> 01:03:31.059 They travel back to Jerusalem for the, 01:03:31.059 --> 01:03:31.299 their, 01:03:31.299 --> 01:03:31.539 their, 01:03:31.539 --> 01:03:31.579 their, 01:03:31.579 --> 01:03:31.940 their main, 01:03:31.940 --> 01:03:32.179 uh, 01:03:32.179 --> 01:03:33.360 festivals and feasts. 01:03:34.980 --> 01:03:35.579 Um, 01:03:35.920 --> 01:03:36.980 and this truth, 01:03:36.980 --> 01:03:39.920 that the earliest church is overwhelmingly, 01:03:39.920 --> 01:03:40.579 uh, 01:03:40.579 --> 01:03:41.980 Jewish as opposed to Greek. 01:03:41.980 --> 01:03:42.840 And I talked about this earlier. 01:03:43.139 --> 01:03:44.420 It lies in stark opposition to, 01:03:44.539 --> 01:03:44.599 again, 01:03:44.659 --> 01:03:46.820 this liberal scholarship that says that it wasn't that way, 01:03:46.820 --> 01:03:49.159 that when the Christian church started to form, 01:03:49.280 --> 01:03:51.000 it was basically Greek. 01:03:51.000 --> 01:03:51.760 It was Paul, 01:03:51.880 --> 01:03:53.219 and it was Paul going out to, 01:03:53.219 --> 01:03:55.380 to Thessalonica and to Corinth and to Ephesus. 01:03:55.380 --> 01:03:57.480 And that's where the church really took form. 01:03:57.480 --> 01:04:02.199 And what was going on in Jerusalem early on was muddled and not defined and, 01:04:02.199 --> 01:04:02.760 uh, 01:04:02.760 --> 01:04:05.159 and not a solid base of the, 01:04:05.159 --> 01:04:05.420 the, 01:04:05.420 --> 01:04:08.159 the solid foundation of the church that spread out from there. 01:04:08.519 --> 01:04:09.519 Paul is the base. 01:04:09.920 --> 01:04:12.360 The Hellenistic Greek Christian is the base. 01:04:12.360 --> 01:04:15.699 And then Christianity explodes into the Roman Empire from that base, 01:04:15.820 --> 01:04:16.820 not from Jerusalem. 01:04:17.139 --> 01:04:18.559 Her tata does an excellent job of saying, 01:04:18.639 --> 01:04:18.880 no, 01:04:19.300 --> 01:04:20.000 not the case. 01:04:20.099 --> 01:04:21.119 The earliest Christian believers, 01:04:21.260 --> 01:04:22.800 the earliest church are overwhelmingly Jewish. 01:04:22.800 --> 01:04:24.080 And it's from that, 01:04:24.500 --> 01:04:25.300 that Paul says, 01:04:25.420 --> 01:04:25.680 all right, 01:04:25.760 --> 01:04:26.600 here's James. 01:04:26.780 --> 01:04:27.539 Here is Peter. 01:04:27.700 --> 01:04:29.539 They've done great work here at the Jewish church. 01:04:29.720 --> 01:04:32.220 I'm going to go now and reach these Greek communities. 01:04:34.320 --> 01:04:34.680 Um, 01:04:35.220 --> 01:04:37.980 her tata establishes primarily through Paul's letters, 01:04:38.120 --> 01:04:38.780 Pauline scholarship, 01:04:38.780 --> 01:04:39.840 a very early, 01:04:40.019 --> 01:04:44.160 very high Christology or acknowledgement and worshiping of Jesus as Lord and Messiah. 01:04:44.700 --> 01:04:45.000 Indeed, 01:04:45.140 --> 01:04:48.780 this early Jewish Christianity almost instantly adopts a by theistic, 01:04:49.640 --> 01:04:52.780 so two gods tradition of recognizing both, 01:04:52.800 --> 01:04:53.920 God and Jesus as Lord. 01:04:54.140 --> 01:04:57.980 So obviously we have a very defined Trinitarian Christ. 01:04:58.060 --> 01:04:59.519 Today we talk about father, 01:04:59.660 --> 01:04:59.760 son, 01:04:59.800 --> 01:05:00.340 and Holy spirit. 01:05:00.519 --> 01:05:02.680 This has been something that has existed for a long time, 01:05:02.720 --> 01:05:04.039 but in the earliest church, 01:05:04.160 --> 01:05:05.840 not a whole lot of talk about the Holy spirit, 01:05:06.120 --> 01:05:09.560 but what her tata finds is that the earliest believers were saying there is God. 01:05:09.680 --> 01:05:10.160 He's God. 01:05:10.240 --> 01:05:11.220 He's been the God of Israel, 01:05:11.300 --> 01:05:11.920 the God of Abraham, 01:05:12.060 --> 01:05:12.260 Isaac, 01:05:12.300 --> 01:05:12.660 and Jacob. 01:05:12.840 --> 01:05:13.800 And there is his son, 01:05:13.860 --> 01:05:14.120 Jesus. 01:05:14.480 --> 01:05:15.320 He is Lord. 01:05:15.420 --> 01:05:15.740 He lived, 01:05:15.800 --> 01:05:16.019 he died, 01:05:16.120 --> 01:05:16.700 he rose from the dead. 01:05:17.039 --> 01:05:17.840 He's God's son. 01:05:18.000 --> 01:05:18.600 He is our Lord. 01:05:18.660 --> 01:05:19.400 Our faith is in him. 01:05:19.780 --> 01:05:22.140 And you have that by, 01:05:22.139 --> 01:05:23.980 that acknowledgement of God and Jesus, 01:05:24.139 --> 01:05:24.879 her tata argues, 01:05:25.539 --> 01:05:26.179 very, 01:05:26.379 --> 01:05:27.059 almost, 01:05:27.279 --> 01:05:28.739 very early, 01:05:28.819 --> 01:05:30.480 a couple of years after Jesus's resurrection. 01:05:31.799 --> 01:05:33.000 Now this suggestion, 01:05:33.379 --> 01:05:34.079 that truth, 01:05:34.599 --> 01:05:37.859 is a complete defilement of that shema that I read to you earlier. 01:05:37.860 --> 01:05:41.920 It is a complete and utter abandonment and defilement of, 01:05:41.920 --> 01:05:42.820 of, 01:05:42.820 --> 01:05:42.880 of, 01:05:42.960 --> 01:05:44.140 of Jewish, 01:05:45.099 --> 01:05:45.519 uh, 01:05:45.519 --> 01:05:46.079 uh, 01:05:46.079 --> 01:05:48.200 core identity. 01:05:48.920 --> 01:05:49.400 Um, 01:05:49.440 --> 01:05:50.820 it's a defilement of the shema, 01:05:50.920 --> 01:05:53.860 the defining Jewish statement and identity spanning over a thousand years. 01:05:53.960 --> 01:05:54.220 Yes. 01:05:54.219 --> 01:05:55.959 Would you, 01:05:55.959 --> 01:05:56.099 would you, 01:05:56.099 --> 01:05:56.219 would you, 01:05:56.219 --> 01:05:56.639 would you, 01:05:56.639 --> 01:05:57.119 would you, 01:05:57.119 --> 01:05:58.779 would you be something to be, 01:05:58.839 --> 01:06:01.639 I thought that the point was that Jesus and the Father are one, 01:06:01.759 --> 01:06:04.879 and that by theism would be more of an invitation to say, 01:06:05.000 --> 01:06:07.599 there's this God here and this other God over here. 01:06:08.019 --> 01:06:10.399 So it seems like it's conceptually different. 01:06:10.619 --> 01:06:10.799 Yeah, 01:06:10.899 --> 01:06:11.059 no, 01:06:11.119 --> 01:06:11.239 they, 01:06:11.239 --> 01:06:11.639 they weren't, 01:06:11.699 --> 01:06:11.779 they, 01:06:11.939 --> 01:06:12.679 you know, 01:06:12.699 --> 01:06:13.299 you are correct. 01:06:13.719 --> 01:06:14.000 Um, 01:06:14.000 --> 01:06:14.359 and again, 01:06:14.500 --> 01:06:15.179 if I had more time, 01:06:15.259 --> 01:06:17.179 I would focus a little bit more on that, 01:06:17.199 --> 01:06:17.399 but no, 01:06:17.439 --> 01:06:17.839 they were not, 01:06:17.919 --> 01:06:19.579 it wasn't that they were separate gods, 01:06:19.699 --> 01:06:22.039 but that they were acknowledging two separate persons. 01:06:22.039 --> 01:06:22.860 That the, 01:06:22.860 --> 01:06:23.119 the, 01:06:23.119 --> 01:06:23.960 the sort of the, 01:06:23.960 --> 01:06:27.559 the earliest traces of a Trinitarian understanding of God, 01:06:27.679 --> 01:06:33.900 of God as being one in three persons happens very early with G and, 01:06:33.900 --> 01:06:34.239 and, 01:06:34.239 --> 01:06:36.199 and scholarship focuses on, 01:06:36.320 --> 01:06:36.719 um, 01:06:37.320 --> 01:06:38.699 within Paul's letters or see, 01:06:38.779 --> 01:06:39.980 Paul seems to be transporting, 01:06:39.980 --> 01:06:40.699 uh, 01:06:40.759 --> 01:06:43.500 hymns that people had sung into his letters, 01:06:43.679 --> 01:06:44.139 uh, 01:06:44.279 --> 01:06:47.139 refrains or phrases that were repeated back to one another. 01:06:47.139 --> 01:06:51.679 And within those hymns and within those refrains that Paul incorporates into his letters, 01:06:51.679 --> 01:06:53.179 it's this high, 01:06:53.500 --> 01:06:54.659 call it high Christology. 01:06:55.139 --> 01:06:56.039 And so Hurtado is saying, 01:06:56.839 --> 01:06:59.919 the fact that Paul is comfortably including these hymns, 01:07:00.019 --> 01:07:03.119 including these refrains in a letter written in 50 AD, 01:07:03.919 --> 01:07:05.960 suggests to me that this Christology, 01:07:06.159 --> 01:07:06.960 this high Christology, 01:07:07.059 --> 01:07:10.839 this high view of Jesus had to have already been formed prior to AD 50. 01:07:11.500 --> 01:07:15.319 So if it's prior to AD 50 and Jesus doesn't die until the AD 33, 01:07:15.319 --> 01:07:19.419 now you have within the lifetime of these eyewitnesses, 01:07:19.539 --> 01:07:20.599 a very high Christology. 01:07:20.599 --> 01:07:22.039 How do you get that? 01:07:22.139 --> 01:07:23.860 And this is sort of the main point that Hurtado makes. 01:07:24.279 --> 01:07:25.539 Hurtado is basically arguing, 01:07:26.239 --> 01:07:34.659 historians cannot explain how you get a Jewish people to abandon their core belief, 01:07:34.960 --> 01:07:36.739 almost instantaneously, 01:07:37.259 --> 01:07:38.739 if this is a hoax. 01:07:39.299 --> 01:07:39.579 If there, 01:07:39.679 --> 01:07:40.739 if Jesus didn't, 01:07:40.819 --> 01:07:41.759 was not raised from the dead, 01:07:42.119 --> 01:07:43.599 if people didn't see him raised from the dead, 01:07:43.719 --> 01:07:48.799 there is no way that you get Jewish people to abandon the thing that defined them as a people 01:07:48.800 --> 01:07:50.039 for a thousand years. 01:07:50.180 --> 01:07:51.120 They would have rejected it. 01:07:51.440 --> 01:07:52.580 They would have rejected it outright. 01:07:52.740 --> 01:07:53.820 It would have been a fringe movement. 01:07:54.140 --> 01:07:55.160 With a few followers, 01:07:55.240 --> 01:07:56.019 it would have died out, 01:07:56.220 --> 01:07:58.820 like the followers of these other Messianic figures in the first century. 01:07:59.180 --> 01:08:01.620 It would not have exploded through Jerusalem, 01:08:01.780 --> 01:08:04.240 and exploded through Asia Minor, 01:08:04.400 --> 01:08:06.800 and eventually into all of the Roman Empire. 01:08:07.120 --> 01:08:08.360 It just wouldn't have done it. 01:08:08.360 --> 01:08:10.220 It would not have been able to withstand that scrutiny, 01:08:10.620 --> 01:08:11.440 if it's not true. 01:08:11.440 --> 01:08:13.940 So that's Hurtado. 01:08:15.519 --> 01:08:18.800 I feel like you did an okay job of kind of touching on these three scholars. 01:08:19.300 --> 01:08:19.840 I brought the books, 01:08:19.960 --> 01:08:21.140 and you can see them for yourself. 01:08:21.239 --> 01:08:22.619 They're definitely worth picking up and reading. 01:08:23.000 --> 01:08:24.020 I think these two, 01:08:24.340 --> 01:08:25.260 specifically, 01:08:25.659 --> 01:08:27.760 are anybody could pick them up and read them. 01:08:27.880 --> 01:08:29.020 Hurtado's and Bauckham's, 01:08:29.039 --> 01:08:30.539 anybody could read it. 01:08:30.560 --> 01:08:31.819 I think you'd do okay with it. 01:08:32.260 --> 01:08:32.440 Right? 01:08:32.739 --> 01:08:33.600 I'm not going to lie to you. 01:08:34.000 --> 01:08:35.359 I think you should still read it, 01:08:35.420 --> 01:08:37.819 but you're going to struggle through big chunks of it. 01:08:37.819 --> 01:08:40.279 But this particular work, 01:08:40.739 --> 01:08:42.659 Wright is really writing for other scholars. 01:08:42.840 --> 01:08:44.000 He's in conversation with other scholars. 01:08:44.319 --> 01:08:46.439 He doesn't really have the average lay person in mind. 01:08:46.779 --> 01:08:47.819 There's going to be a lot of Greek in it, 01:08:47.840 --> 01:08:48.279 a lot of Hebrew, 01:08:48.399 --> 01:08:49.579 and a lot of stuff that might be over your head. 01:08:49.819 --> 01:08:51.880 But it's still a great resource, 01:08:52.000 --> 01:08:52.759 and it's still worth reading. 01:08:53.399 --> 01:08:54.219 So I hope, 01:08:54.439 --> 01:08:55.179 now if there are any questions, 01:08:55.279 --> 01:08:55.479 I mean, 01:08:55.719 --> 01:08:56.599 yes, go ahead. 01:08:56.599 --> 01:08:57.659 I have a question. 01:08:57.819 --> 01:08:57.979 Yeah. 01:08:59.439 --> 01:09:00.599 First of all, 01:09:02.119 --> 01:09:04.319 I want this question, 01:09:04.519 --> 01:09:06.239 and someone know later on. 01:09:06.239 --> 01:09:10.519 what would be the exactly period, 01:09:11.519 --> 01:09:13.979 because we are talking about period historically, 01:09:14.359 --> 01:09:14.659 right? 01:09:14.739 --> 01:09:16.699 To make sure there is a person. 01:09:17.260 --> 01:09:22.539 But what would be for this kind of period in Bauckham? 01:09:23.199 --> 01:09:24.059 This is perfect. 01:09:24.579 --> 01:09:26.859 This is what I can figure out. 01:09:27.159 --> 01:09:31.819 Because when we bring gospel in like the United States, 01:09:32.659 --> 01:09:34.920 historically it's different from here, 01:09:34.920 --> 01:09:36.079 like in other countries. 01:09:36.380 --> 01:09:39.880 This is the first question I want to figure out. 01:09:40.239 --> 01:09:41.399 Because all this stuff, 01:09:41.680 --> 01:09:43.500 this seminary like the world, 01:09:43.739 --> 01:09:44.359 it's one thing. 01:09:44.880 --> 01:09:46.380 The second thing is that 01:09:46.380 --> 01:09:49.720 the resilient resurrection 01:09:49.720 --> 01:09:52.420 is the core of gospel, 01:09:52.420 --> 01:09:52.779 right? 01:09:52.779 --> 01:09:56.779 And this is one fundamental thing 01:09:56.779 --> 01:09:59.399 in Muslim country, 01:09:59.399 --> 01:09:59.880 in Israel, 01:10:00.039 --> 01:10:00.739 from the century, 01:10:01.340 --> 01:10:02.719 the resurrection 01:10:02.719 --> 01:10:07.519 for Muslim Islamic people. 01:10:07.779 --> 01:10:09.000 They don't believe this. 01:10:09.519 --> 01:10:10.279 They don't believe. 01:10:10.659 --> 01:10:12.079 And when you turn around, 01:10:12.319 --> 01:10:12.840 they say, 01:10:13.380 --> 01:10:14.659 Jesus didn't die. 01:10:15.880 --> 01:10:16.219 Right? 01:10:16.420 --> 01:10:16.599 Right. 01:10:16.600 --> 01:10:18.140 And it's what Pontius said. 01:10:18.340 --> 01:10:20.180 Because this isn't just a diet that means, 01:10:20.260 --> 01:10:20.820 this is a rose. 01:10:21.440 --> 01:10:23.220 But they believe, 01:10:23.600 --> 01:10:27.300 this was a famous prophet like Muhammad. 01:10:27.560 --> 01:10:27.960 Right. 01:10:28.400 --> 01:10:28.600 Yeah. 01:10:28.660 --> 01:10:30.900 But they didn't recognize that this is a diet. 01:10:31.060 --> 01:10:31.240 Right. 01:10:31.760 --> 01:10:32.520 This is one thing. 01:10:32.560 --> 01:10:32.860 I don't know. 01:10:33.060 --> 01:10:33.600 I don't know. 01:10:33.600 --> 01:10:33.760 I don't know. 01:10:33.760 --> 01:10:35.360 Because the way 01:10:35.359 --> 01:10:37.880 we are going to then 01:10:37.880 --> 01:10:39.000 prosper in 01:10:39.000 --> 01:10:41.439 in all the countries like 01:10:41.439 --> 01:10:41.939 Animes, 01:10:42.059 --> 01:10:43.119 like in our own country, 01:10:43.699 --> 01:10:44.859 all the people 01:10:44.859 --> 01:10:45.859 are believers. 01:10:46.359 --> 01:10:48.119 But one fundamental thing 01:10:48.119 --> 01:10:49.719 they don't know 01:10:49.719 --> 01:10:50.460 after death. 01:10:50.899 --> 01:10:51.259 That's it. 01:10:51.500 --> 01:10:52.119 This is where 01:10:52.119 --> 01:10:53.319 most of Christians 01:10:53.319 --> 01:10:56.219 are from Animes. 01:10:56.699 --> 01:10:58.079 But for Muslim, 01:10:58.979 --> 01:11:00.179 when after death, 01:11:00.259 --> 01:11:00.880 what they say, 01:11:00.960 --> 01:11:01.219 they say, 01:11:01.219 --> 01:11:01.500 okay, 01:11:01.859 --> 01:11:02.599 what we'll see. 01:11:03.939 --> 01:11:04.219 Yeah. 01:11:04.220 --> 01:11:07.220 And don't you find it curious 01:11:07.220 --> 01:11:08.880 that I spent a lot of time 01:11:08.880 --> 01:11:09.480 talking about 01:11:09.480 --> 01:11:10.240 how the resurrection 01:11:10.240 --> 01:11:12.760 really is the most important point 01:11:12.760 --> 01:11:14.800 that when you look at the life of Jesus 01:11:14.800 --> 01:11:15.680 or the life of Isa 01:11:15.680 --> 01:11:17.079 as a Muslim might have 01:11:17.079 --> 01:11:18.039 recognized him, 01:11:18.680 --> 01:11:20.260 they would be interested 01:11:20.260 --> 01:11:21.220 in that life, 01:11:21.320 --> 01:11:21.960 in that teaching, 01:11:22.039 --> 01:11:22.600 in his childhood, 01:11:22.720 --> 01:11:23.300 and in his youth, 01:11:23.320 --> 01:11:24.000 and in his ministry. 01:11:24.539 --> 01:11:25.260 But then, 01:11:25.400 --> 01:11:25.680 you're right, 01:11:25.780 --> 01:11:26.680 the crucifixion, 01:11:26.760 --> 01:11:27.119 the resurrection, 01:11:27.240 --> 01:11:27.900 they deny that. 01:11:28.340 --> 01:11:30.940 And it's just not part of Islam. 01:11:31.640 --> 01:11:32.640 Isn't it curious 01:11:32.640 --> 01:11:33.860 that the one area 01:11:33.859 --> 01:11:35.179 that they leave out 01:11:35.179 --> 01:11:36.079 is the one area 01:11:36.079 --> 01:11:36.859 that I've hopefully 01:11:36.859 --> 01:11:38.179 put forth a good argument today 01:11:38.179 --> 01:11:39.159 to say that it is 01:11:39.159 --> 01:11:39.659 the founding, 01:11:39.939 --> 01:11:40.619 that without it, 01:11:40.699 --> 01:11:42.239 you have nothing. 01:11:42.619 --> 01:11:43.279 And your first question 01:11:43.279 --> 01:11:43.679 is what, 01:11:43.819 --> 01:11:44.719 you're asking when? 01:11:44.960 --> 01:11:45.139 When? 01:11:45.139 --> 01:11:45.199 When? 01:11:45.199 --> 01:11:45.500 When? 01:11:45.859 --> 01:11:47.920 Muhammad and Jesus Christ, 01:11:48.000 --> 01:11:48.359 it's very, 01:11:48.519 --> 01:11:48.539 it's very, 01:11:48.539 --> 01:11:49.239 it's very, 01:11:49.479 --> 01:11:49.500 it's very, 01:11:49.500 --> 01:11:49.539 it's very, 01:11:49.539 --> 01:11:50.079 it's very, 01:11:50.079 --> 01:11:51.239 because the way 01:11:51.239 --> 01:11:52.539 we are going to 01:11:52.539 --> 01:11:53.559 present Oxford 01:11:53.559 --> 01:11:54.939 in here, 01:11:55.059 --> 01:11:55.420 the Syria 01:11:55.420 --> 01:11:56.099 is something 01:11:56.099 --> 01:11:57.299 very different. 01:11:57.659 --> 01:11:57.759 Yeah. 01:11:58.039 --> 01:11:58.799 In all the countries 01:11:58.799 --> 01:11:59.299 to this one, 01:11:59.359 --> 01:12:00.179 I want to make sure 01:12:00.179 --> 01:12:00.859 you have the work. 01:12:00.859 --> 01:12:02.199 Muhammad arises, 01:12:02.460 --> 01:12:03.119 and I don't remember 01:12:03.119 --> 01:12:03.880 the exact date, 01:12:03.960 --> 01:12:04.679 but I know for sure 01:12:04.679 --> 01:12:05.759 that it's after 300 01:12:05.759 --> 01:12:06.779 and before 500. 01:12:07.579 --> 01:12:08.619 After 300 AD 01:12:08.619 --> 01:12:09.460 and before 500, 01:12:09.579 --> 01:12:10.199 I can't remember 01:12:10.199 --> 01:12:10.899 if it's 350 01:12:10.899 --> 01:12:11.799 or if it's 425, 01:12:12.319 --> 01:12:12.719 that is something 01:12:12.719 --> 01:12:13.519 I have to look up again, 01:12:13.579 --> 01:12:14.619 I forgot the exact one, 01:12:14.679 --> 01:12:15.519 but I know for sure 01:12:15.519 --> 01:12:16.500 that it's after 300 01:12:16.500 --> 01:12:17.899 and before 500 AD. 01:12:17.899 --> 01:12:19.460 So there is at least 01:12:19.460 --> 01:12:20.659 300 years 01:12:20.659 --> 01:12:23.799 of Christian church history 01:12:23.799 --> 01:12:24.920 that passes 01:12:24.920 --> 01:12:26.579 before Muhammad 01:12:26.579 --> 01:12:28.000 is born 01:12:28.000 --> 01:12:30.379 and is seen 01:12:30.379 --> 01:12:31.359 as a prophet 01:12:31.359 --> 01:12:31.839 and, 01:12:31.960 --> 01:12:33.879 well, 01:12:34.079 --> 01:12:34.799 there's a lot to be said 01:12:34.799 --> 01:12:35.319 about Muhammad 01:12:35.319 --> 01:12:35.839 and Islam. 01:12:36.000 --> 01:12:36.579 I don't have the time 01:12:36.579 --> 01:12:36.939 to do that, 01:12:36.979 --> 01:12:37.979 but it is an interesting topic. 01:12:38.439 --> 01:12:39.079 Sixth century. 01:12:39.699 --> 01:12:40.279 Sixth century, 01:12:40.359 --> 01:12:41.159 so 500. 01:12:41.879 --> 01:12:42.099 500. 01:12:43.519 --> 01:12:44.500 Is there any other questions? 01:12:45.979 --> 01:12:46.259 Again, 01:12:46.359 --> 01:12:46.739 I hope, 01:12:46.739 --> 01:12:49.359 I really hope that, 01:12:49.460 --> 01:12:49.619 again, 01:12:49.659 --> 01:12:50.920 this was a lot of information. 01:12:51.380 --> 01:12:52.559 I did want it to be 01:12:52.559 --> 01:12:53.219 a little bit more 01:12:53.219 --> 01:12:54.139 dumbed down than that. 01:12:54.199 --> 01:12:54.679 I wanted to have 01:12:54.679 --> 01:12:55.380 less bullet points 01:12:55.380 --> 01:12:56.139 and so on and so forth. 01:12:56.460 --> 01:12:57.619 And as I was writing it out, 01:12:57.659 --> 01:12:58.420 I really felt like, 01:12:58.800 --> 01:12:59.819 I feel like I'm doing 01:12:59.819 --> 01:13:00.939 more harm than good 01:13:00.939 --> 01:13:01.760 if I just say, 01:13:02.059 --> 01:13:02.939 here's a little snippet 01:13:02.939 --> 01:13:03.719 to throw at somebody 01:13:03.719 --> 01:13:04.539 who's an unbeliever 01:13:04.539 --> 01:13:05.579 and I didn't give you 01:13:05.579 --> 01:13:06.319 all those other things. 01:13:06.399 --> 01:13:06.819 I didn't give you 01:13:06.819 --> 01:13:07.739 the context to it. 01:13:08.099 --> 01:13:08.840 It really would have 01:13:08.840 --> 01:13:10.019 just been an empty point. 01:13:10.239 --> 01:13:10.399 You might, 01:13:10.939 --> 01:13:11.179 hey, 01:13:11.260 --> 01:13:11.619 what do you think? 01:13:12.039 --> 01:13:12.880 Take this, buddy. 01:13:13.399 --> 01:13:14.819 Here's a little factoid for you 01:13:14.819 --> 01:13:16.439 and if they pressed you on it, 01:13:16.439 --> 01:13:17.000 there would be nothing 01:13:17.000 --> 01:13:17.659 behind it for you 01:13:17.659 --> 01:13:18.559 to really flesh it out. 01:13:19.299 --> 01:13:19.839 Thank you. 01:13:21.119 --> 01:13:21.500 Great. 01:13:21.719 --> 01:13:21.960 Thanks. 01:13:21.960 --> 01:13:22.019 Thanks. 01:13:29.019 --> 01:13:30.500 Did you have something up for? 01:13:30.699 --> 01:13:31.460 Somebody's walking away? 01:13:31.559 --> 01:13:31.639 Yes. 01:13:31.759 --> 01:13:32.299 I didn't see a hand. 01:13:32.559 --> 01:13:32.759 Yes. 01:13:32.879 --> 01:13:33.960 Would you mind writing down 01:13:33.960 --> 01:13:35.019 the three books? 01:13:35.239 --> 01:13:35.419 Sure. 01:13:35.419 --> 01:13:35.559 Sure. 01:13:35.560 --> 01:13:36.539 Someone read them? 01:13:38.580 --> 01:13:39.740 Sure. 01:13:40.020 --> 01:13:40.400 Sure. 01:13:40.400 --> 01:13:40.640 Sure. 01:13:40.780 --> 01:13:41.280 Sure. 01:13:41.280 --> 01:13:41.860 Sure. 01:13:41.960 --> 01:13:42.539 People. 01:13:42.680 --> 01:13:42.900 Yeah. 01:13:42.900 --> 01:13:43.160 Sure. 01:13:43.200 --> 01:13:43.539 Sure. 01:13:44.060 --> 01:13:45.780 Sure. 01:13:46.300 --> 01:13:47.420 Sure. 01:13:47.940 --> 01:13:50.160 Sure. 01:13:50.160 --> 01:13:52.320 Sure. 01:13:52.320 --> 01:13:52.520 Sure. 01:13:52.940 --> 01:13:54.240 Sure. 01:13:54.240 --> 01:13:54.760 Yeah. 01:13:55.960 --> 01:13:56.340 Sure. 01:14:00.480 --> 01:14:01.520 Sure. 01:14:01.520 --> 01:14:03.360 Sure. 01:14:03.360 --> 01:14:04.380 Sure.