Let's open in a word of prayer.
Father in heaven, we, once again, we confess our immense thanks that you have shed your love on us through your Holy Spirit.
! Lord, we don't deserve these blessings and these things. You give us all we need to know you, to walk with you, to be in your light.
And more than that, Lord, you give us this wonderful church, this safe place. You've planted us in this city.
We pray, Lord, that we would use these gifts for your glory, to spread your kingdom.
We pray today, and this moment in particular, that you would give us wisdom about that very difficult question of Christianity and Christians regarding warfare.
Give us insight. Give us insight into your word, into your calling on our lives as citizens, but also many of us are voters.
And we just pray that you give us wisdom in these things, and we pray all this in the name of Jesus Christ. Amen.
Amen.
Okay, friends. I was here two weeks ago. The original plan was for us to do capital punishment and then warfare, but then some people's schedule got confusculated,
and then so I'm two weeks late or a week late. But whereas with capital punishment, we talked about using lethal force against someone who had perpetrated a horrific crime.
Today, we're going to be talking about using lethal force that almost by necessity will be used against people who have not committed a crime.
So this is the idea of warfare.
And one definition that distinguishes something like capital punishment from warfare is that warfare is a broader use of force in which very likely some innocent people will be caught up in what is being conducted.
That's what makes warfare such a difficult question and such a fraught question.
As you can tell, perhaps, from this definition of warfare, we could expand this to talk about the use of physical force or violence at all.
So on the one hand, we could talk about warfare in a broader sense to include all kinds of physical force or violence that, when used, has a somewhat reasonable chance of affecting innocent people.
I'm speaking about things like certain police work or if you are doing a security operation or if you're serving in the military but in peacetime or issues of self-defense or potentially moments of heroic but violent self-sacrifice,
where you see something happening and you decide to do something to prevent a terrible act from occurring.
That's perhaps a broader view where you still have this idea of using violence where there's potential for innocence being affected,
whereas a narrower definition would limit warfare to simply what we would traditionally think of as a war, like nation-states fighting against one another.
But all of these questions are bound up in the idea of Christianity and warfare, of Christians and violence.
Is it ever appropriate to use violence as if you are a Christian?
And if so, when and how?
What are the reasons why?
In our last class that I was teaching with you on capital punishment,
the position that I took was that a capital punishment, clearly you see in Scripture that God has mandated it on occasion.
It's not inherently wrong at all times because God did ask it to be carried out at times.
But in that class, I didn't take a position on whether capital punishment should be used in our country today.
That's sort of a separate question, and I presented different points of view.
Today, on this class on warfare, I'm going to do something a little bit different.
Instead of not taking positions or sides on warfare, what I'm going to suggest is that perhaps God can call faithful Christians
to different paths regarding a specific instance of warfare.
That there could be different paths that God genuinely calls Christians that are part of the same community of faith down
in terms of whether to be pacifistic or whether to support the war, and if so, how to support the war.
And I'll explain all that as we go.
What our outline will be is it'll be similar from the last time I was with you,
where I'm going to kind of talk about different passages in Scripture,
some of which appear to support the idea that warfare can be just at times under specific circumstances,
and then passages that can suggest that, no, Christians are called to a different or higher purpose.
I do this so that you can see perhaps the motives and the reasoning behind Christians who take both sides of the question.
Then I want to walk us through a brief history of Christians and pacifism on the one hand,
and then Christians and just warfare on the other hand,
because it turns out we actually have two great traditions in the church,
where on the one hand there will be Christians who argue that the Scriptures support pacifism,
and then we have Christians who argue that, no, the Scriptures support that there are times when warfare is justified.
And then I'll present some thoughts on this,
and then some lessons that we can draw from what we've learned,
and going forward if we're ever faced with very difficult situations like warfare.
Let's get started.
What I'm going to do now is put the, you know, a scholar would call this the locus classicus.
It's the verse that is sort of the calling card of Christian pacifism.
It's Jesus' Sermon on the Mount.
It's Matthew chapter 5, verse 38.
And it's a pacifism.
I'm terrible at spelling.
Yeah, I got that right.
And Jesus says this,
You have heard that it was said, an eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth.
But I say to you, do not resist an evil person.
But whoever slaps you on your right cheek, turn the other to him also.
If anyone wants to sue you and take your shirt, let him have your coat also.
Whoever forces you to go one mile, go with him too.
Give to him who asks of you, and do not turn away from him who wants to borrow from you.
Pacifism takes these verses quite literally.
When Jesus says, do not resist an evil person, they take these verses as meaning we should not participate in warfare.
That you should not try to resist an evil person with violence.
It's a straightforward reading.
If you continue reading Jesus' Sermon on the Mount, you know, Jesus will say things like,
Love your enemies.
Pray for those who persecute you.
And the pacifist will say, Jesus meant that.
He meant to love your enemies.
He meant to do these things.
However, you know, someone could point to other things where Jesus says,
I say, make no oath at all, either by heaven, for it is God's throne.
Let your statement be yes, yes, or no, no.
Anything beyond this is of the evil one.
And someone could reply that I'm not sure he only wants us saying yes, yes, no, no.
I think he's getting at the heart of vows you can't keep and taking the Lord's name in vain.
But this is probably the gold star of Christian pacifism is Matthew 538.
Of course, though, there are many other verses.
They're counterpoints for the idea of just war.
I'm only going to choose one or two.
There are certainly probably better ones because especially in the Old Testament,
there's so many warfare verses.
But I did want to choose one or two in particular that I thought were particularly thought-provoking.
This one is from 1 Samuel 17.
And this is, of course, the famous story of David and Goliath,
where David goes out.
The Israelite armies are arrayed in warfare against the Philistines.
Goliath, this warrior, is coming out challenging the Israelite armies
and defying the God of Israel.
It's very blasphemous.
And no warrior is willing to stand before this giant Goliath, this mighty warrior.
And David, young David, who's probably just a teenager, he's probably like 15 or something.
And he says he will fight Goliath.
And he says,
And Saul said to David,
And of course, as you all know,
David kills Goliath, chops off his head,
and earns a great victory.
What is interesting about this is that there is a psalm of David, Psalm 144,
where he says,
Blessed be the Lord my rock who trains my hands for war and my fingers for battle.
He is my steadfast love and my fortress,
my stronghold and my deliverer,
my shield and he in whom I take refuge,
who subdues peoples under me.
So this sort of warrior act or warrior ethos that was exhibited by David is also commemorated in the Psalms.
And that gives it a little more than just a historical account.
Sometimes you read the Old Testament,
and of course not all the stories of what people do in the Old Testament are meant to give us moral examples to follow.
Sometimes they're actually the opposite.
They're supposed to show us how not to do things.
But in this case,
there's a psalm commemorating David as a warrior and as a fighter.
So that's one counterpoint on the just war side of things.
I want to walk through a few others.
This one is...
I'm going to go in reverse order here.
I'm going to do the just war passage first.
Now, some people...
We talked about this in the capital punishment class.
Some people might look at these.
A pacifist might respond to this and say,
Yes, that's true,
but that is the Old Covenant.
And in the New Covenant,
we are called to higher and better things.
And that's where this passage is interesting.
This is in Luke chapter 22.
This is towards the very end of Jesus's ministry.
I think this is actually the day...
It's the last week of Jesus's life.
And Jesus says to the disciples,
he sort of gives them a parting warning.
And he says,
When I sent you out with no money bag or knapsack or sandals,
did you lack anything?
This is when he sent out the apostles two by two.
And then he sent out the 70.
And he asked,
Did you lack anything?
And they said,
Nothing.
And he said to them,
But now let the one who has a money bag take it,
and likewise a knapsack.
So he's warning them,
tough times are going to come.
And then he says this,
And let the one who has no sword sell his cloak and buy one.
For I tell you that this scripture must be fulfilled in me,
and he was numbered with the transgressors.
He's prophesying his unjust death that's about to happen.
And the disciples respond to this,
and they say,
Look, Lord, here are two swords.
And he said,
That's enough.
It's a cryptic passage.
There's a lot of surprising things about this.
One, Jesus tells them to sell their cloak and buy a sword.
And then they respond and they say,
Actually, we already have swords.
And it looks like the disciples are bringing weapons of warfare around with them,
when they're with Jesus, apparently.
That's what's going on.
But then Jesus also,
you know,
he doesn't,
he says that's enough.
Like, it's almost like he's trying to restrain them at the same time.
But still, it's very interesting.
Swords, remember, there were no guns back then.
And so bringing a sword was how you would defend yourself when you're on the way between cities and things like that.
So that's what they're bringing around, apparently.
However, there are some counterpoints here.
If we keep reading the Gospels,
and we come to when Jesus is arrested,
this also happens in Luke.
So this is just very shortly after Jesus had said about the necessity of bringing a sword.
In Matthew 26,
Jesus is arrested.
Judas, one of the twelve,
comes up with swords and clubs.
And Judas gives a sign,
and he says,
the one whom I kiss
is the man,
sees him.
And he comes up to Jesus at once,
and he says,
greetings, Rabbi.
And he kisses him,
and Jesus says,
friend,
do what you came to do.
And then they came up and laid hands on Jesus
and seized him.
And behold,
one of those who were with Jesus,
this is Peter,
we know from other Gospels,
he stretched out his hand,
he drew his sword,
he struck the servant of the high priest
and cut off his ear.
So he seems to be doing what Jesus literally just recommended.
And then Jesus says,
put your sword back into its place,
for all who take the sword will perish by the sword.
Do you think that I cannot appeal to my Father,
and he will at once send me more than twelve legions of angels?
Hmm.
Here we have the classic scenario of using violence.
Jesus has just recommended they buy swords,
people are coming to attack them unjustly,
a disciple unsheathes his sword and attacks.
Peter does this,
and Jesus rebukes him.
And we know from other Gospels,
he heals the man who had his ear cut off.
And then he says,
don't you think
I could appeal to my Father
and he would send twelve legions of angels
to take care of all this?
But how then,
he says,
should the Scriptures be fulfilled
that it must be so?
There's a partner passage with this.
If we keep reading the Gospels,
one of my joys is taking the Gospels
and weaving them together in chronological order.
If you keep reading
and you come to
John,
oh,
I forgot the chapter verse.
It's when Jesus is standing before Pontius Pilate.
It's verse 36.
I forget the actual chapter.
He's standing before Pontius Pilate
in the Gospel of John
and Pontius Pilate is just mystified
that Jesus is not defending himself more,
that he's not.
And Jesus says this,
my kingdom is not of this world.
If my kingdom were of this world,
my servants would fight
that I not be delivered over to the Jews.
But my kingdom is not of this world.
18.
John 18.
Here we have
a very fitting partner passage
where Jesus explains,
hey,
my kingdom is not from here.
My kingdom is a spiritual kingdom.
Otherwise,
my servants would be fighting for me.
But I'm part of a greater kingdom,
a higher kingdom.
So I hope you see the juxtaposition
between these passages.
It also shows,
I think these illustrate
the difficulties of these questions
because in some sense,
I mean,
the disciples were carrying swords.
Jesus recommended they get a sword.
But then,
he also clearly had
very strict conditions
when you might use these things
at minimum.
If you want to go the pacifistic route,
you could also argue
that perhaps he was saying
something symbolically.
He didn't mean the use of literal swords.
But either way,
you see how these questions
are very difficult
and they're fraught
about Christians and violence
and Christians and warfare.
Well,
we do have some other
very interesting passages
that I want to make sure
we go through.
This is when,
this is regards
how the New Testament
treats soldiers.
And one passage
where we find this
is in the early passages
of the Gospel of Luke.
Luke,
and I,
you know,
I cut off the chapter again.
I think it's Luke 4,
but it's verse 10.
It's 3 or 4,
where a crowd
is around John the Baptist
and they're asking,
what should we do?
And he answers,
whoever has two tunics
is to share with him
who has none.
Whoever has food
is to do likewise.
Tax collectors also come
to be baptized by John
and they say to him,
teacher,
what shall we do?
And John says,
collect no more
than you are authorized
to collect.
Chapter 3.
Luke chapter 3,
verse 10.
Then soldiers,
Roman soldiers,
come to John
and they say,
and what shall we do?
And he says to them,
do not extort money
from anyone by threats
or by false accusation
and be content
with your wages.
That's what he says.
He doesn't say
abandon your post.
He doesn't say
never use violence.
He just says,
don't extort money.
Be content with your wages.
Soldiers are always
rioting in the ancient world.
Be content with your wages.
Interesting.
Very interesting.
Here's another one.
You might say,
well, that was John the Baptist.
You know,
we're still technically
Old Covenant here.
Maybe that's what he's doing.
But there is
another parallel case
with Jesus.
It's not quite as explicit,
but in another sense,
it's also interesting
for different reasons.
This is when our Lord,
this is Matthew chapter 8.
Our Lord enters Capernaum.
That's his home base
of ministry.
And a centurion,
so this is an officer
in the Roman army.
He comes to him
and he says,
my servant is lying paralyzed
at home suffering.
And Jesus says,
I will come and heal him.
But the centurion says,
Lord,
I'm not worthy
to have you come under my roof.
This is a very moving passage.
In the Gospels,
the full context is
that some Jewish leaders
come to Jesus
and they say,
hey,
you got to help this guy out.
He's worthy.
He's given us money
for this synagogue.
He's done all this great stuff.
He's worthy for you
to do this.
But then the centurion says,
I am not worthy
for you to do this for me.
He's a man of great humility
and faith.
And the centurion says,
I'm not worthy
to have you come under my roof,
but only say the word
and my servant will be healed.
And this is important
for our question here.
He says,
I too am a man under authority
with soldiers under me.
And I say to one,
go and he goes
and to another,
come and he comes
and to my servant,
do this and he does it.
When Jesus heard this,
he marveled
and he said to those,
truly I tell you,
with no one in Israel
have I found such faith.
I tell you,
many will come from the east
and the west
and recline with Abraham,
Isaac and Jacob
in the kingdom of God
while the sons of the kingdom
will be thrown
into the outer darkness.
And to the centurion,
Jesus said,
go, let it be done
for as you have believed,
it will be done.
And the servant was healed
at that very hour.
There are two things here.
One is that Jesus is here
teaching a centurion,
a man in the Roman military
and he compliments his faith.
He doesn't rebuke him
for his military service.
He doesn't tell him,
yes, you have great faith,
but you do need to do
this one important thing.
He actually gives him
one of the greatest compliments
he gives anyone
in the scriptures.
And furthermore,
the second point is that
what has the centurion
just said to Jesus?
This, this centurion just,
the centurion gave an example
of how he conducts his life
in the military
about ordering soldiers.
He says, I tell soldiers
to do this and they do it.
And that's why I know
that you can do this, Lord.
So the centurion gives
an argument of Jesus's,
of his faith in Jesus
based on his own
military service.
And Jesus accepts
this argument.
He says, this is,
this man has immense faith.
So, hmm,
interesting food for thought.
But, just like last time,
you know, if we wanted to,
the pacifists could respond
by saying, well, you know,
the gospels
and the New Testament
as a whole
call us to higher things.
And often,
the New Testament
does not explicitly
delve into details
of social order.
You know,
it doesn't always
as openly condemn slavery
as we would hope,
for instance.
And perhaps,
this is an example
where Jesus was,
was simply
treating the centurion
as an individual.
He wasn't thinking
of the larger social
implications of his
military service
or something like that.
Should we not
be thinking of these things
in the full unfolding
of the gospel
and the resurrection
of Jesus
like Isaiah 9
talks about?
Isaiah 9,
verse 5 says,
this beautiful prophecy
of Jesus,
for every boot
of the trampling warrior
in battle tumult
and every garment
rolled in blood
will be burned
as fuel for the fire.
For to us,
a child is born.
To us,
a son is given.
And the government
shall be upon his shoulders
and his name
shall be called
Wonderful Counselor,
Mighty God,
Everlasting Father,
Prince of Peace.
And of the increase
of his government
and of peace,
there will be no end.
The pacifist would say
that this should be our goal.
We follow Jesus,
the Prince of Peace.
And yes,
perhaps the centurion,
Jesus did not openly
condemn the centurion,
but we are called
to greater things
than this.
And Isaiah 9 prophesies
such a thing.
I think,
actually,
this now occurs to me,
I think I skipped
a very important passage.
I don't know why
I skipped this.
So if you don't mind,
I'm going to reverse order here.
that argument that,
oh,
perhaps the centurion
was doing something
maybe
a pacifist might argue
not inherently sinful
but not
what we're called
to be doing,
if that makes sense.
Sometimes you'll hear
these sorts of arguments.
We see examples of this
with David.
Remember,
David was called
to warfare,
but in 1 Chronicles,
when he is trying
to build God's temple,
King David says
that,
I had it in my heart
to build a house
of rest
for the ark
of the covenant
of the Lord
and for the footstool
of our God,
and I made preparations
for building,
but God said to me,
you may not build
a house for my name,
for you are a man
of war
and have shed blood.
And that's in
the Old Covenant.
So what happens?
Solomon,
his son,
builds the temple
and Solomon's name
means peace.
He's the one
who built it.
So,
you see sort of
the intertwining paths.
I have not,
I have not articulated
a single argument
for pacifism.
I mean,
there's different kinds
of arguments
for pacifism.
One is an absolutist one
where war is never permitted.
It's a horrific crime.
But there's lesser forms
of it.
There's the arguments
that, well,
that's not what we should
ever strive for.
It's always defiling
somehow.
It's never the higher
calling.
There's also those
arguments
for pacifism as well.
But of course,
those who hold
to just war
have a large number
of scriptural passages
on their side
as well.
For instance,
the disciples
bringing swords
around with them
is one of them.
Now,
what I want to do now
is give just a brief
overview of the history
of pacifism
and then a brief
overview of the history
of just war theology.
And I'm going to go
quickly here.
I'm realizing I'm already,
I think I'm already
going slower
than I anticipated.
This book,
The Early Church
on Killing,
a comprehensive source book
on war,
abortion,
and capital punishment
is very useful.
It's a fairly comprehensive
collection of excerpts
from Christian writings
in the first 300 years
of the church
that have to do
with war,
abortion,
and capital punishment.
And it's well done.
The excerpts
are from older translations,
so they can be
a little difficult
to follow.
The reason why
this is important
is because when you look
at the history
of pacifism,
there are two
main streams
of thought.
One is the Anabaptists,
the other is
the early church.
both of them
were pacifistic.
In fact,
the early church
was almost universally
pacifistic.
And I wanted to
read to you
just some quick highlights
from the early church
so you can get a sense
of the passion
that the early church
had for not
practicing warfare.
Remember that
these Christians
are writing at a time
when no Christian
is in governmental power,
they're being
sometimes horrifically
persecuted.
So here we go.
Athenagoras of Athens,
he's writing
in the year 180,
he articulates
that Christians
oppose abortion,
infanticide,
gladiatorial contests,
and then he says,
how then,
when we do not
even look
on gladiatorial contests,
lest we should contract
guilt and pollution,
how then
should we put people
to death.
Tertullian in 225,
he denounces
gladiatorial contests,
but he goes even further
and he insists,
quote,
God puts his prohibition
on every sort
of man killing.
Tertullian,
I love Tertullian,
but he was
about as extreme
as you can get.
Tertullian even argues
that the shedding
of human blood
cannot be forgiven.
But what he probably
means by that
is not that God
won't forgive it,
but that the church
can't forgive it.
In other words,
you're permanently
excommunicated.
Still very harsh,
extremely harsh,
but that's Tertullian
for you.
Minucius Felix,
writing around
the year 200,
he says,
to us,
as Christians,
it is not lawful
either to see
or to hear
of human slaughter.
Origen,
in 254,
unequivocally insists
that under no circumstances
should Christians kill.
And he says,
he warns Christians,
quote,
lest because of warfare
or the vindication
of our rights
or for any occasion
we should take the sword,
there is no such occasion
that is allowed
by the gospel teaching.
We must use the sword
against no one.
That's what Origen said.
He says,
and I quote him here,
nowhere does Christ teach
that it is right
for his own disciples
to offer violence
against anyone,
however wicked
they might be.
Christ did not deem it
in keeping with his laws
to allow the killing
of any individual
whatever.
Cyprian,
writing in 258,
he insists that manslaughter
is a mortal crime.
He says,
he's referring to his flock
and he says,
we are of those
who, quote,
may not kill
but who must be killed.
And he's writing
in this time
of terrible persecution.
It goes on.
I could keep going here.
You know,
Lactantius around the year 300
says,
Christians are ignorant of war.
They are friendly
to their enemies.
They do not commit war
or commit murders.
Putting someone to death
is wrong,
he says.
Lactantius says,
every kind of killing
is wrong.
Abortion,
infanticide,
exposure of newborn children,
gladiatorial contests,
capital punishment,
and warfare,
he believes,
are all wrong.
He even says
that it is wrong
to accuse someone
of a capital crime
because it makes
no different,
quote,
whether you put a person
to death by word
or by sword.
That's how intense
these people were.
They were straight
down the line.
Our first,
one of our earliest
church orders,
this is a church manual
of how you baptize,
how you do the Eucharist,
how you bring in
new members,
and this church order
says that those
who are gladiators
or teach gladiators
or teach swordsmanship
or teach military skills
or weapons training,
they should stop
or they will be excluded
from baptism.
So the early church
was very,
fairly universal in this.
However,
we do have examples,
if I can give a counterpoint
to this,
we do have examples
of Christians serving
in the military
in the early church.
That does come up.
Tertullian,
he's one of the harshest
guys on this.
He even talks about
one of these situations
where he compliments
the Christian soldiers.
So it's not
totally universal,
but there is a quote,
if I can find it,
that the author
of this volume,
this author of this volume
put together,
he says,
and I think this is fair,
he says that
in all of our
hundreds and hundreds
and hundreds of pages
of writings
that we have
from the early church,
there is not
a single statement
that explicitly allows
Christians to serve
in the military.
They're either silent on it
or they're negative on it.
Yes?
All of these individuals
who have made this
pretty clear
past this commentary,
have any of them
written on Luke 22?
So,
Origen has some homilies
on Luke 22.
No,
he has some homilies
on Luke.
I don't know if the homilies
cover Luke 22.
That would be a great
question to ask,
especially because
when Origen said
those statements,
he was talking about
the Matthew 26 passage
where Jesus says,
those who use the sword
will die by the sword.
So,
I don't know
if he then
went and looked
at that one.
Ivor.
Yeah.
I was kind of drafted
and I joined the Navy
to avoid the Army.
Okay,
yeah,
yeah.
And my ship,
the Enterprise,
was doing close air support
of the Marine Corps.
Yeah.
And I was part
of the ship.
So,
that makes me
combat veteran.
Yes.
Yeah.
So,
according to what
you're saying,
I could be included
from church services
for serving
when my government
kind of forced me
into the military?
I don't think that.
Yeah.
But,
there are people
in the early church
who would have said that.
Okay.
That would exclude
members of this congregation.
It would also exclude
members of our families
who serve in the military.
My nephew
is in the military
right now.
And,
my grandfather
and many of my ancestors
served in the military.
They took a really
extreme position
of which I'm going to,
we're about to turn
to the just war theory.
So,
I don't want to end
on this note.
There is another
point of view here
that I'm about to present.
I will also say
about the early church
that
I think
all of those quotations,
though they are very powerful
and all-encompassing,
they are not as universal
as you think.
If you read the early church,
you understand that
we,
the actual
on-the-ground work
of the local churches,
there are soldiers
in those churches.
We know that
from archaeological excavations.
We know that
from other,
from,
um,
Christians,
writers who will mention
Christian soldiers
in the service of Rome.
Uh,
we know that this happened.
We know that it was
fairly common.
We know that they were
welcomed in.
So,
while
the quotations
that we have
universally support
pacifism,
we know that as a whole
that was not what
the early church
actually did
all the time,
if that makes sense.
Peter?
Um,
this time period,
I'm not great
with my church history,
is also,
uh,
during the time
where there was
active persecution
by the military
of the Christians.
Yep.
And could that
be the reason
why they say,
don't be in the military
because they're going
to be ordered
to kill fellow Christians?
And,
and there was
often forced
pagan worship
in the military,
where you had
to swear allegiance
to the genius
of Caesar,
the spirit of Caesar
and worship him
and do incense
to the emperor
as a show of loyalty
to the empire.
That is a huge factor
and,
and people will say that.
Another factor is,
uh,
this sounds really extreme,
but remember,
these are people
who are being slaughtered
for their faith at times
and they are saying
very similar things
to every Christian
that,
so a soldier,
you might respond
and say,
well,
if I'm a soldier,
that means I have to die.
But they're saying
that because if I abandon
my post,
I'll be executed.
But they are saying
the same things
to so many other
non-soldiers
who are in very
similar circumstances.
So they're not
singling out soldiers
for having to risk
something terrible
to leave.
This is for everybody.
Everybody's doing
all of this.
So,
while it is extreme,
you have to remember
they're,
they're casting this net
over pretty much
the whole flock.
Um,
there are,
remember that women
had almost zero rights
in the Roman Empire.
A Roman male citizen
could execute his wife
or children.
He could do that.
They had slaves.
You would have,
if you were a pastor
in a church,
you're going to have slaves
who go home
and get raped
by their masters.
You're going to have
people who are horribly
beaten by their fathers
with no recourse
at all.
This is just,
people who are signed up
for the gladiatorial contest
and compelled
to go and be slaughtered.
I mean,
all of these things
are happening.
So,
uh,
they,
they're living
in really terrible times.
So,
that does breed
extremism
by necessity.
By necessity.
So,
keep that in mind.
Um,
final point,
and this will be
our transition.
Uh,
I,
I want to
honor
and,
and be inspired
by the faith
of our Christian
forebears
in the early church.
But,
it is one thing
to say these,
when you're,
these,
these kind of statements
when you're not in power,
it's another thing
to be in power
and allow violence
to be perpetrated
against innocent people.
And,
that brings in
just war theory.
And,
it turns out
that for 300 years,
Christians were not in power
in the Roman Empire.
And,
then an emperor
comes along
named Constantine
who became a Christian.
And,
he declared freedom
of religion.
Often people say
he made Christianity
the official religion.
He didn't.
He declared freedom
of religion.
He said,
you cannot persecute people
due to their religious beliefs.
It's one of the most
extraordinary
sociological statements
ever.
That he,
he was the one
who,
who really initiated this
for the first time.
And,
all of a sudden
you have a Christian
in power.
What do you do?
And,
this is where
just war theory
begins.
And,
the question
that those
in power
who are Christians
ask is,
should we let
evil go
unopposed?
C.S. Lewis
wrote an essay.
It's in the book
The Weight of Glory
and it's titled
Why I Am Not a Pacifist.
And,
he wrote it
in World War II.
And,
he says,
does anyone suppose,
so he's referring to
Matthew 538
where our Lord says,
do not resist
an evil person.
He says,
does anyone suppose
that our Lord's hearers
understood
good his words
to mean
that if a
homicidal maniac
attempting to murder
a third party
tried to knock me
out of the way
that I should stand
aside and let him
get at his victim?
And,
C.S. Lewis,
it's a complicated essay
but he makes
some good points.
But,
he highlights
that issue
of,
is Jesus here
talking about
personal,
personal vendettas
and vengeance here
or is he talking
universally about
the use of violence
to protect
the innocent?
And,
C.S. Lewis
would say,
he's talking about
personal,
personal
vendettas
and vengeance
and things like that.
He is not saying,
hey,
if you happen
to be a police officer
and you see
some wrong happening,
don't do anything.
That's not
what he's saying.
Yes,
Iver?
C.S. Lewis
lived through the blitz.
Yeah,
he was World War I
in the trenches.
Yeah,
and World War I
in the trenches.
And the blitz as well,
yes.
Yeah,
so,
the blitz,
six months,
bombs were dropped
from the sky
every night.
Yeah,
he knew
what he was talking about.
He lived through the blitz.
Yeah.
And I think
that colors
what he believes.
Yes,
I agree.
So,
all of a sudden,
when does
just war theory
first get articulated?
Well,
it starts becoming
articulated
when Christians
finally get into power
and they realize
that,
hey,
we can't just
like let
wrongs happen
here.
So,
the major proponent
of just war theory,
the first one
is Augustine
and his words
are then
the next major,
or there's many
major proponents
of it,
but there's Augustine
and then there's
Thomas Aquinas.
Augustine says,
or he suggests
that loving
our neighbor
can mean
self-defense
of the state.
He said,
Augustine suggests
that loving
our foreign neighbors
may mean using force
to punish evildoers
or to right a wrong.
Thomas Aquinas
writes,
he says,
true religion
looks upon
as peaceful,
so he says,
true religion
looks upon
as peaceful
those wars
that are waged
with the object
of securing
peace.
So,
Thomas Aquinas
says,
it is peaceful
to wage wars
in order to secure
peace,
but he says
they should not be
waged for motives
of greed
or cruelty,
but instead
for punishing evil,
securing peace,
and uplifting the good.
Thomas Aquinas
argued,
and you will see
his words
being used
by many theologians
since,
but Thomas Aquinas
argued that
for a war
to be just,
he had three categories,
he said,
for a war
to be just,
it has to be
carried out
by someone
in the proper authority.
He says,
it's not for
individuals
to declare war
on people.
It has to be done
through the proper
authorities,
that's number one.
Number two,
he said,
that it needs
a just cause.
Your cause
needs to be
just.
He says,
a just cause
is required,
namely,
those who are
attacked
should be attacked
because they
deserve it
on account
of some fault,
to right
a terrible wrong,
to protect
people who
are being
slaughtered.
Those are
why you
should carry
out a just
war.
In fact,
Aquinas
quotes
Augustine,
where Augustine
says that
a just war
should be
described as
one that
avenges
wrongs
when a
nation or
state must
be punished
for refusing
to make
amends for
the wrongs
inflicted on
its subjects
or to
restore what
that state
has seized
unjustly.
So you're
trying to
prevent this
state from
inflicting
wrongs,
you're trying
to prevent
them from
doing so
in the
future,
you're trying
to recover
what was
lost,
you're trying
to do
something
like this.
And then
third,
he says
that you
also need
to have
what he
says,
just
intent.
And this
is very
perceptive
of him
because he
says it's
not enough
to have
just cause
because you
can come
up with a
just cause
why you
need to
invade a
country,
but if
you're really
just wanting
to get
rich off
their stuff,
that doesn't
count.
You have
to have
the just
intent.
Now,
in our
society today,
we could
perhaps add
to this
and maybe
show how
things are
complicated.
Proper
authority,
well,
that's
difficult
in a
democracy.
It's
also
difficult
if
you find
yourself
in a
terrible
situation
where
you're
witnessing
a
violent
crime.
Maybe
we don't
call it
warfare,
but you
might have
to do
something
that could
risk
harming
others.
So this
is a little
bit more
complicated.
Another
issue is
the issue
of,
we heard
this in
the wars
today,
in the
war in
Gaza,
proportionality.
So some
people think
that just
wars should
be proportional,
but people
will define
what they
mean by
that differently.
Some people
will say
that a
just war
should be
proportional.
They should
only carry
out violence
to the
extent that
violence
had been
carried out
by the
evildoer.
Other people
say,
no,
that's not
what proportionality
means.
Proportionality
means that
the violence
that you
use should
be proportional
in order
to stop
the future
evil from
happening.
So that
might mean
you do
have to
escalate the
violence,
but only
because that's
proportionally
required to
prevent the
evil from
continuing to
occur.
Do you see
the two
differences
there?
So one
difference,
if some
tribe goes
and kidnaps
10 people
or kills
10 people
from another
tribe,
the victim
tribe would
only be allowed
to kill
10 other
people in
one
interpretation
of
proportionality,
in another
interpretation,
the victim
tribe would
be able
to do
as much
violence
as necessary
to prevent
the killing
from continuing.
Does that
make sense?
Those are
two very
different
positions.
And then
another
issue
is
the fog
of war.
This is a
really big
issue,
knowing what
is actually
happening.
And I'll
use an
example here.
In our
day and
age,
is there a
famine in
Gaza or
not?
People debate
about whether
that's
happening.
And if it
is happening,
is it
caused by
Israel?
If so,
is it
caused
intentionally?
Or is it
caused by
Hamas?
Because they're
trying to
curry favor
with people.
This is the
fog of war.
How you
answer those
questions will
affect your
position on
whether the
war in
Gaza was
just or not.
Or if it's
continuing the
nature of
it continuing
after two
years is
just.
And it's
the fog of
war.
We don't
always know
what's
happening.
I'll give
an example.
I read a
book to my
kids called
The Great
Escape.
Wonderful book,
really gripping
read.
It's about this
amazing World
War II escape
story from a
POW camp.
And it's
these British
officers who
are in a
Nazi prisoner
of war camp
in Germany.
And they're
trying to escape
and they hate
the Nazis and
a lot of the
soldiers, the
German guards
are jerks and
everything.
But it turns
out the Nazi
officer who was
in charge of
the camp was
actually like
you're reading
this and he
comes up every
now and then
and you're
like this guy
is a nice
guy.
He's watching
out for the
soldiers.
He's not
taking advantage
of them.
And I looked
him up and he
was a very
interesting guy.
He opposed
the Nazis when
they came to
power.
But then he
was a military
man.
But then when
the war started
he was
conscripted into
the service.
So he decided
to serve.
And they put
him in charge
of a POW
camp I'm
sure because
they didn't
trust him.
Probably because
they didn't want
him on the
front lines because
they didn't
trust his
loyalty.
So they made
him in charge
of this POW
camp.
And he
acted justly
towards the
prisoners.
He never
took advantage
of them,
never abused
them.
And there
was an
incident when
the Nazis
were losing
the war where
an order came
down warning
the head of
the camps that
hey we might
give an order
any day now
where we're
going to ask
you to execute
all the prisoners.
And the
German officer
got this
order and he
turned and said
to his fellow
officers well I
guess we will
just have to
die because he
was going to
refuse to do
it.
And after
the Nazis
lost and all
the Nazi
officers were
arrested,
they're soliciting
evidence for
their war crimes
and the
British POW
soldiers said
no that guy
didn't do
anything.
He was good
and he was
released.
And so here
we have this
example of
how difficult
it is.
The fog of war
question comes
up because
the question
is did he
know about
the concentration
camps the
Nazis were
doing?
I mean I'm
not a World
War II expert.
I do know
that many people
were unaware
of these things
or they heard
about them but
didn't believe
them.
They thought
there were
propaganda.
propaganda is
happening all
the time.
What do you
believe?
I don't know.
But we have
an instance of
a man in a
terrible situation.
He's conscripted
into the army.
If he doesn't
serve he might
die.
And it's just
a very hard
situation to
be in.
On the other
hand we have
another example
in World War
II.
Dietrich
Bonhoeffer.
One of our
beloved theologians
who opposed the
Nazis as a
German pastor
and attempted
to assassinate
Hitler.
So he took
the exact
opposite tactic
in the same
war.
And this
just gets
at the
messiness
of warfare.
warfare.
We could go
on and on
for hours and
do many
passages about
this and
many lessons
to draw.
But I want
to close with
several lessons
to draw from
the scriptural
passages on
pacifism and
those on
just war and
theories of
just war and
theories of
pacifism.
one is that
I think we
can fairly
conclude that
God can
call a
faithful
Christian to
use a just
form of
violence in
certain
circumstances.
However,
I believe
God can
also use a
Christian,
God can
also call a
Christian to
pacifism in
certain
circumstances.
It depends
on your
calling.
It also
depends on
the circumstances.
One thing
though,
that is
universal for
all Christians
is we are
called to
lay our
life down
for our
neighbors and
even for
our enemies.
We are
called to
love our
enemies.
We are
called to
deny ourselves
and follow
him.
We may not
all be called
to the same
thing with
respect to a
given war.
God called
David to
warfare.
God called
Solomon to
peace.
I think
that perhaps
we should
have in
our mind
and in
our hearts
what the
apostle Paul
recommended
regarding those
who differ
on certain
matters or
I think
who are
called to
do different
things.
This is in
Romans chapter
14 where
Paul says,
who are you
to pass
judgment on
the servant
of another?
It is
before his
own master
that he
stands or
falls.
He will
be upheld
for the
Lord is
able to
make him
stand.
Now Paul
goes on to
give an
example about
celebrating
different days
and marking
different holidays
as sacred.
He says,
one person
esteems one
day as better
than another
while another
esteems all
days alike.
Each one
should be
fully convinced
in his own
mind.
The one who
observes the
day observes it
to honor the
Lord.
The one
who eats
eats in
honor of
the Lord
since he
gives thanks
to God.
While the
one who
abstains
abstains in
honor of
the Lord
and gives
thanks to
God.
I think
we could
say much
the same
about many
instances of
people differing
in a matter
of whether a
war is just
or what we
are called
to do in a
specific terrible
situation.
Like if
Connecticut was
invaded all
of a sudden.
I'm sure we
would be called
to do different
things at
different times.
And both
of these
could involve
laying down
our lives
and sacrificing
ourselves.
Whether it's
serving as a
soldier or
whether laying
down our
lives to love
your neighbors
or to
minister to
the wounded
or whatever
your call
may be.
Kunle gave
me this great
example of
the body of
Christ.
Paul talks
about how we
are all part
of one body
but we're not
the same parts.
And if you
push that
analogy, you
think that,
you know,
there are
things you
would do
with your
feet that
you would
never do
with your
tongue or
with your
nose.
There's
things that
would horribly
defile you
if you were
doing it with
your tongue
but you
could do it
with your
feet.
You could
walk all
over the
ground.
You're not
going to
lick the
ground.
And Kunle
was like,
that's the
way it is
with Christians.
That there's
some things
that some
Christians
just can't
do and
aren't called
to do.
It's not
out of
weakness.
It's that
they are not
called to do
it.
But then
there's
other
things that
some
are called
to do.
And I
think we
can use
David and
Solomon as
an example
of these
things.
Okay,
it is
9.55
so we
have time
for one
or two
questions
if any
of you
have it.
Yes?
How does
just war
in corn
support
technological
advances?
I know.
Yes,
I know.
our
tax dollars
go to
like we
have,
I think
our,
they say
that the
largest air
force in
the world
is the
United States
and the
second largest
air force
is the
U.S.
Navy
because our
military is
so huge.
how does
technological
advancement
affect this?
That is a
great question.
Remember,
guns are
a technological
advancement
and so
when Jesus
is talking
about swords,
he wasn't,
you know,
take a sword
with you.
There's a
genuine debate.
If he was in
the 20th century,
would he say
take a gun
or is gun
just way
too over
the top?
You know,
way too
over the top.
It's not
what he
was talking
about.
And then,
of course,
there's,
I mean,
there's no way
I can answer
this question
in just a few
seconds.
It's just,
it affects
everything we
do.
I mean,
violence is
all around
us.
We have
the weapons
now to
kill millions
of people.
Someone
who's
completely
untrained
can do
unbelievable
amounts of
damage,
whereas in
the ancient
world,
that really
was not
possible.
If you
were,
most people,
it would be
very hard to
kill more
than one or
two people,
no matter
how hard you
tried,
because you'd
be stopped.
If you were
a very skilled,
strong person,
you could do
a little more,
but it's
going to be
hard.
And now
that is
just not
the case.
And it's
not just
weapons,
it's also
things like
cars and
trucks.
I mean,
you could
do all
sorts of
horrible
things with
these instruments
of technology.
Yeah,
it's tough.
Let's
conclude in
prayer,
and then I'll
be here for
a few more
minutes if
you want
to chat.
Father,
we thank
you for
your word.
Lord,
we live in
a violent
society,
in a society
where violence
is a push
of a button
away,
where instead
of going to
gladiatorial
contests,
we can view
people dying
on the
internet
in our
pockets.
Lord,
we pray
that you
would help
us to
guard our
hearts,
to dedicate
ourselves to
you.
We pray
that you
would help
us to lay
our lives
down for
our enemies,
to be
bearers of
the cross
of Christ,
to not
walk the
way of
the world.
Lord,
we pray
that if
warfare comes
or these
difficult choices
come,
that you
would help
us to
act not
as the
world,
but to
live for
a future
kingdom,
Lord,
whatever your
calling may
be,
whether to
serve in
the military
or not,
that we
would serve
you ultimately
above all.
And we
pray this
in the name
of Jesus.
Amen.
Thanks,
folks.
Amen.
Thank you.