WEBVTT

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 in prayer together.

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 Father in heaven, we thank you for this chance to gather together,

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 to fellowship, to worship you.

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 We pray that your spirit would be with us in this hour

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 as we learn about the origin of Christmas.

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 But above all, Father, we ask that we would rejoice

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 at the birth of your Son, our Savior.

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 We thank you that more than 2,000 years ago,

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 you sent him to be born for us and to live and minister

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 and walk among us, to forgive sins and to heal

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 and to suffer and rise again on the third day.

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 Father, we ask that his resurrection would be powerful to us, Lord,

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 that we would feel it in our inmost being, that deposit,

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 that promise that you have given to us of eternal life

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 with you forever.

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 And we pray this in the name of your Son, Jesus.

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 Amen.

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 Okay, everybody.

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 So welcome to our class on the date of Christmas.

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 We're going to talk about a few things today.

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 We're going to talk about when was Jesus born?

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 We're going to answer that question.

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 We're also going to ask the question,

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 was Christmas originally a pagan holiday?

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 Because if you're familiar, popular culture will often say

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 that Christmas is based on an old ancient Roman pagan holiday

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 that was adopted by Christians because they wanted

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 the birth of Jesus to resonate with, you know, a pagan society,

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 and they wanted to make Christianity attractive.

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 So they chose this date to get, you know,

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 some of those pagans to come around to worshiping Jesus.

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 We're going to look at that question.

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 And then we're also going to look at another question,

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 which is just, does it really matter what day Jesus was born

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 or if Christmas was based on a pagan holiday?

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 And we're going to go in reverse order.

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 So we're going to start with this one here about whether it really matters.

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 And to talk about whether it matters,

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 we're going to listen to someone who has some wise things to say.

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 And I'm speaking about the Apostle Paul in his letter to the Romans.

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 And he says in Romans chapter 13, he says,

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 one person esteems one day as better than another,

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 while another esteems all days alike.

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 Each one should be fully convinced in his own mind.

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 The one who observes the day observes it in honor of the Lord,

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 and the one who eats eats in honor of the Lord,

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 since he gives thanks to God,

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 while the one who abstains abstains in honor of the Lord

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 and gives thanks to God.

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 For none of us lives to himself and none of us dies to himself.

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 So what Paul is saying here,

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 he's in a context where people are arguing about

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 what days they should celebrate and mark.

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 If you look at the Old Testament,

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 there's a lot of holidays in the Old Testament,

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 and there were disputes in the early church

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 about whether Christians needed to or should follow those,

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 or whether it was even wrong to follow those.

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 And Paul here gives like a very sort of moderate position

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 where he says, you know,

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 really the most important thing he says

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 is that you should be,

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 let me see if I can get my little spotlight here,

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 you should be fully convinced in your own mind.

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 So for Paul, all days are made by God.

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 And if we choose to mark a day to worship God,

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 that's great.

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 If we choose to mark a day to go about

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 the other things God has called us to do,

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 no matter what we choose,

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 we're all following God in this.

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 And Paul gives a little bit more advice.

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 He goes on in the same passage.

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 He says, why do you pass judgment on your brother or you?

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 Why do you despise your brother?

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 For we will all stand before the judgment seat of God.

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 Therefore, let us not pass judgment on one another any longer,

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 but rather decide never to put a stumbling block

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 or a hindrance in the way of a brother.

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 What Paul is saying here is that

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 not only should we be convinced in our own minds

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 about what days to celebrate and mark,

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 he says we shouldn't pass judgment

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 on people who think differently,

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 that we should be merciful

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 and that we should,

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 and whatever we do,

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 we should not put a stumbling block

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 or a hindrance in the way of another brother

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 as they're coming to Jesus.

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 And whether that means observing a day

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 or not observing a day,

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 we should do it all for the glory of God

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 and for the benefit of other people.

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 Now, some of you might be reading this

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 and thinking, okay, that's well and good,

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 but maybe there's a difference

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 if what we're talking about has pagan roots.

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 So maybe it's okay what Paul is saying

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 if we're talking about days and stuff

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 that have to do with Old Testament law

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 and things like that

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 and whether we should follow it,

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 but what if it's not Old Testament law?

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 What if it's, you know, a pagan holiday?

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 What about that?

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 Well, Paul also addresses a similar issue

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 in another letter.

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 He says to the Corinthians

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 in his first letter, chapter eight,

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 he's talking about if people should eat food

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 offered to idols

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 because back in the day

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 when Rome was a polytheistic society,

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 you'd go to the marketplace to get your meat

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 and a lot of the meat

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 had actually been sacrificed to an idol at some point.

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 And Christians were wondering,

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 should I eat this?

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 Has it been permanently contaminated?

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 And this is what Paul says.

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 He says,

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 As to eating a food offered to idols,

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 we know that an idol has no real existence

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 and that there is no God but one.

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 However, not all possess this knowledge,

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 but some, through former association with idols,

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 eat food as really offered to an idol

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 and their conscience being weak is defiled.

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 Food, he says,

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 will not commend us to God.

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 We are no worse off if we do not eat

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 and no better off if we do.

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 But take care that this right of yours

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 does not somehow become a stumbling block to the weak.

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 And so what Paul is saying here is,

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 well, of course it's bad to worship idols,

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 but if you're just eating meat,

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 it's not inherently contaminated.

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 However, if, you know,

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 obviously if you used to worship idols in this way,

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 then it might be hard for you to do it

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 and then you shouldn't do it.

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 You should follow your conscience.

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 He says,

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 Above all,

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 you should follow your conscience

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 and you should not do anything

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 that causes another brother or sister to stumble.

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 Now, when we kind of take this thinking

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 and apply it to the date of December 25th,

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 the birthday of Jesus,

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 which some people say is based on a pagan holiday,

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 I think we can come to the same conclusions,

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 that God made all days,

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 he's in charge of all of them,

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 and what some people did hundreds and hundreds

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 and hundreds of years ago

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 shouldn't necessarily determine

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 what we're going to do today.

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 However, we should be gracious and kind to other people

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 if they feel differently,

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 especially perhaps if they grew up thinking this way

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 or through former association with idols or something

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 and they feel like they can't celebrate it,

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 well, that's fine too.

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 And the reality is, guys,

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 that we do this all the time without knowing it.

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 So, for instance,

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 even the days of the week are based off of pagan days.

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 So, for instance,

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 Thursday is named after the god Thor, Thor's day,

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 and we still use it

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 because we just don't associate it with paganism anymore.

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 Or the months of the year,

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 January, Janus, god of doorways, Augustus,

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 he was deified,

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 he was a Roman god after he was emperor,

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 that's where the month of August comes from,

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 or his wife, maybe.

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 So we do this all the time.

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 And it gets, you know,

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 even in New Testament,

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 we can find this,

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 Apollos, he was that disciple,

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 associate of the apostles.

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 He's named after the god Apollo.

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 And he kept his name.

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 People change their names all the time

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 in the New Testament and Old Testament,

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 but he kept it.

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 And it was just, that was his name.

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 And it didn't necessarily involve paganism,

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 even though it may have had

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 some etymological connection with it.

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 And we could go even further

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 because our beloved word in the New Testament,

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 grace,

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 the three graces were actually pagan deities.

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 And this is in part because

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 the way polytheism works,

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 at least in the Roman Empire,

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 is they had gods and goddesses for everything.

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 So if we were going to cut all that out,

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 we'd be left with no streams,

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 no rivers,

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 no mountains,

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 no sky.

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 I mean, you just name it.

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 So we have to kind of go with Paul's advice here

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 or else we won't be able to do anything at all.

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 So that answers our first question

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 about does it really matter

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 if Christmas was a pagan holiday?

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 And I think the answer is,

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 from Paul's perspective,

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 it doesn't really matter.

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 If our conscience is bothered by it,

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 that's great.

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 We don't have to celebrate it.

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 But all in all,

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 there's nothing inherently wrong with that,

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 even if it was true.

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 But now we want to get to the other question.

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 Was Christmas originally a pagan holiday?

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 So people keep saying it,

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 but is it true?

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 It'd be kind of interesting to find out.

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 What's up?

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 I do have a question.

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 Is there any controversy

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 within different Christian traditions

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 about this question?

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 So there are,

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 you will,

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 there's a small,

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 small minority of people

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 that will make a claim.

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 For those of you listening at home,

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 the question is,

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 is there a current controversy

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 in Christian traditions

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 about Christmas being a pagan holiday?

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 And the answer is,

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 not really.

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 There has been more in the past,

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 like in the 17th and 18th century,

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 there were some theologians

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 that were making that claim more.

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 It was kind of like an anti-Catholic claim

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 where they were saying

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 that this whole Christmas thing,

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 it's not in the Bible,

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 it's a pagan holiday

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 that the Catholic Church adopted.

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 It was much more a live issue

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 a few centuries ago.

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 You'll still find some people

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 making that claim.

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 The bigger debate

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 in the large umbrella

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 of Christian traditions

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 is that there are people

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 that celebrate Christmas

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 on a different day,

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 but that's because

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 of calendar issues.

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 It's complicated,

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 but the Eastern Orthodox,

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 their calendar works differently,

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 so what they think

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 December 25th is

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 is a week or 10 days

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 or 13 days different

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 from our December 25th.

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 But you never know.

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 It might become

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 a live issue again.

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 So we're going to look at

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 where does the date of Christmas

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 as December 25th come from?

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 And how is it chosen

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 as the birth of Jesus?

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 Why do we celebrate Christmas

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 on December 25th?

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 It was a pagan holiday.

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 Okay, it was a pagan holiday.

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 It was the fifth day

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 of the Saturnium.

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 Yes, so okay.

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 So the traditional answer

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 that you'll get

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 of why do we celebrate Christmas

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 on December 25th

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 is that it's based

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 on the Roman pagan holiday

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 called Saturnalia,

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 which was this kind of long holiday

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 where Romans would get together

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 in a lot of revelry

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 and drinking and carousing

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 and stuff like that.

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 And it was in December.

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 Well, so I think scholars

00:10:50.779 --> 00:10:52.320
 are agreed that it was not

00:10:52.320 --> 00:10:53.779
 based on Saturnalia.

00:10:53.980 --> 00:10:54.160
 Yes.

00:10:54.160 --> 00:10:55.700
 Well, what it really comes down

00:10:55.700 --> 00:10:57.020
 to the emperor decided

00:10:57.020 --> 00:10:59.220
 that December 25th

00:10:59.220 --> 00:11:00.220
 was Christ's birthday

00:11:00.220 --> 00:11:02.220
 and from then on it was.

00:11:02.860 --> 00:11:05.220
 Well, it's a little more complicated.

00:11:05.540 --> 00:11:06.320
 Yeah, I know it is.

00:11:06.400 --> 00:11:06.600
 Okay.

00:11:06.940 --> 00:11:07.460
 But really,

00:11:07.700 --> 00:11:08.720
 when you break it down,

00:11:08.820 --> 00:11:09.540
 that's what happened.

00:11:09.539 --> 00:11:13.059
 So the Saturnalia,

00:11:13.219 --> 00:11:14.000
 the two holidays

00:11:14.000 --> 00:11:15.199
 that are given

00:11:15.199 --> 00:11:17.620
 for why Christmas

00:11:17.620 --> 00:11:18.079
 was chosen

00:11:18.079 --> 00:11:19.099
 as December 25th

00:11:19.099 --> 00:11:20.019
 is some people say

00:11:20.019 --> 00:11:20.659
 it was based off

00:11:20.659 --> 00:11:21.579
 of the pagan holiday

00:11:21.579 --> 00:11:22.740
 Saturnalia.

00:11:24.439 --> 00:11:25.299
 Others will give

00:11:25.299 --> 00:11:26.240
 a different holiday

00:11:26.240 --> 00:11:26.980
 that I'll talk about

00:11:26.980 --> 00:11:27.419
 in a moment.

00:11:27.639 --> 00:11:28.480
 But let's deal

00:11:28.480 --> 00:11:29.439
 with the Saturnalia thing

00:11:29.439 --> 00:11:29.799
 right now.

00:11:29.899 --> 00:11:30.839
 So if you look up

00:11:30.839 --> 00:11:31.839
 ancient practices

00:11:31.839 --> 00:11:33.000
 to do with Saturnalia,

00:11:33.419 --> 00:11:34.219
 the funny thing

00:11:34.219 --> 00:11:34.980
 is that it actually

00:11:34.980 --> 00:11:36.659
 wasn't on December 25th.

00:11:36.659 --> 00:11:39.219
 It was on different days

00:11:39.219 --> 00:11:40.000
 in December.

00:11:40.120 --> 00:11:41.019
 And as far as we can tell,

00:11:41.120 --> 00:11:42.939
 it never was on December 25th.

00:11:43.539 --> 00:11:45.319
 And so the idea

00:11:45.319 --> 00:11:46.879
 was that some people

00:11:46.879 --> 00:11:47.939
 try and make the leap

00:11:47.939 --> 00:11:48.819
 by saying that

00:11:48.819 --> 00:11:51.139
 maybe Saturnalia

00:11:51.139 --> 00:11:51.639
 was supposed to be

00:11:51.639 --> 00:11:52.379
 a fun holiday.

00:11:52.539 --> 00:11:53.360
 So maybe Christians

00:11:53.360 --> 00:11:54.600
 chose Christmas

00:11:54.600 --> 00:11:55.240
 because it was supposed

00:11:55.240 --> 00:11:55.980
 to be a fun holiday

00:11:55.980 --> 00:11:57.559
 and maybe they chose it

00:11:57.559 --> 00:11:58.759
 to be next to Saturnalia.

00:11:58.860 --> 00:12:01.179
 But it doesn't really add up.

00:12:01.740 --> 00:12:02.600
 Christmas is still

00:12:02.600 --> 00:12:03.419
 several days away.

00:12:03.579 --> 00:12:04.199
 And then originally,

00:12:04.399 --> 00:12:04.679
 remember,

00:12:04.679 --> 00:12:05.779
 Christmas was not this

00:12:05.779 --> 00:12:06.439
 kind of like

00:12:06.439 --> 00:12:07.599
 Christmas present

00:12:07.599 --> 00:12:08.319
 kind of thing.

00:12:08.439 --> 00:12:10.279
 It was a solemn occasion.

00:12:11.219 --> 00:12:12.419
 So that one

00:12:12.419 --> 00:12:13.159
 doesn't really add up.

00:12:13.239 --> 00:12:14.019
 There's another one,

00:12:14.099 --> 00:12:14.199
 though,

00:12:14.219 --> 00:12:15.319
 that makes a little more sense

00:12:15.319 --> 00:12:16.139
 that we'll talk about

00:12:16.139 --> 00:12:17.459
 in just a moment.

00:12:18.120 --> 00:12:20.739
 And to get

00:12:20.739 --> 00:12:23.239
 at why Christmas

00:12:23.239 --> 00:12:23.919
 was chosen,

00:12:24.079 --> 00:12:24.959
 we've got to go back

00:12:24.959 --> 00:12:25.679
 in the midst of time

00:12:25.679 --> 00:12:26.059
 a little bit.

00:12:26.099 --> 00:12:27.019
 What we're looking at here

00:12:27.019 --> 00:12:29.099
 is a document called

00:12:29.099 --> 00:12:30.179
 the Chronography

00:12:30.179 --> 00:12:32.319
 of 354 A.D.

00:12:32.439 --> 00:12:33.579
 It was a calendar

00:12:33.580 --> 00:12:34.800
 that was put together

00:12:34.800 --> 00:12:36.120
 by a guy named Philo Callus.

00:12:36.220 --> 00:12:37.280
 I know you can't see his name,

00:12:37.340 --> 00:12:38.040
 but it's actually written

00:12:38.040 --> 00:12:39.040
 right there.

00:12:39.840 --> 00:12:40.920
 And he wrote

00:12:40.920 --> 00:12:42.259
 in 354 A.D.

00:12:42.379 --> 00:12:43.040
 And he wrote

00:12:43.040 --> 00:12:43.620
 a calendar

00:12:43.620 --> 00:12:45.740
 for the people of Rome

00:12:45.740 --> 00:12:46.600
 and the church in Rome

00:12:46.600 --> 00:12:47.980
 in 354 A.D.

00:12:48.540 --> 00:12:48.980
 And

00:12:48.980 --> 00:12:51.520
 in this calendar,

00:12:51.860 --> 00:12:52.900
 he says

00:12:52.900 --> 00:12:53.620
 it's the first

00:12:53.620 --> 00:12:54.780
 undisputed

00:12:54.780 --> 00:12:57.139
 piece of evidence

00:12:57.139 --> 00:12:58.140
 saying that

00:12:58.140 --> 00:12:59.840
 Jesus was born

00:12:59.840 --> 00:13:01.800
 on December 25th.

00:13:01.799 --> 00:13:03.439
 So

00:13:03.439 --> 00:13:05.699
 the ironic thing

00:13:05.699 --> 00:13:06.319
 about this

00:13:06.319 --> 00:13:06.919
 is that

00:13:06.919 --> 00:13:08.439
 in another passage

00:13:08.439 --> 00:13:09.639
 in the same document,

00:13:09.859 --> 00:13:10.819
 he says

00:13:10.819 --> 00:13:12.059
 that December 25th

00:13:12.059 --> 00:13:12.959
 was also

00:13:12.959 --> 00:13:14.539
 the birthday

00:13:14.539 --> 00:13:16.699
 of what he says

00:13:16.699 --> 00:13:17.159
 is

00:13:17.159 --> 00:13:18.240
 Invictus,

00:13:18.659 --> 00:13:19.699
 which is a little

00:13:19.699 --> 00:13:20.139
 ambiguous.

00:13:20.139 --> 00:13:20.859
 It's Latin

00:13:20.859 --> 00:13:22.559
 for the unconquered one,

00:13:22.759 --> 00:13:23.919
 but it seems

00:13:23.919 --> 00:13:24.719
 to refer

00:13:24.719 --> 00:13:25.799
 to the Roman

00:13:25.799 --> 00:13:26.939
 sun god

00:13:26.939 --> 00:13:28.059
 Saul.

00:13:28.240 --> 00:13:28.779
 Saul.

00:13:28.899 --> 00:13:29.919
 Saul Invictus.

00:13:29.919 --> 00:13:31.000
 Here's a mosaic

00:13:31.000 --> 00:13:31.879
 of Saul Invictus,

00:13:32.139 --> 00:13:33.159
 the unconquered sun.

00:13:34.000 --> 00:13:34.919
 And so the other

00:13:34.919 --> 00:13:35.699
 pagan holiday

00:13:35.699 --> 00:13:37.479
 that people will say

00:13:37.479 --> 00:13:38.799
 Christmas is based off of

00:13:38.799 --> 00:13:40.459
 is the birthday

00:13:40.459 --> 00:13:42.159
 of the sun god,

00:13:42.259 --> 00:13:43.159
 the Roman sun god,

00:13:43.299 --> 00:13:44.099
 Saul Invictus.

00:13:44.539 --> 00:13:45.699
 And that

00:13:45.699 --> 00:13:47.099
 was on

00:13:47.099 --> 00:13:48.339
 December 25th.

00:13:48.919 --> 00:13:49.240
 And

00:13:49.240 --> 00:13:50.679
 so there is

00:13:50.679 --> 00:13:51.199
 an issue here

00:13:51.199 --> 00:13:52.099
 because the question is

00:13:52.099 --> 00:13:52.719
 does that word

00:13:52.719 --> 00:13:53.179
 Invictus

00:13:53.179 --> 00:13:53.679
 actually refer

00:13:53.679 --> 00:13:54.279
 to this guy?

00:13:54.439 --> 00:13:55.019
 It could refer

00:13:55.019 --> 00:13:55.480
 to Jesus.

00:13:55.679 --> 00:13:56.759
 He is the unconquered one.

00:13:56.879 --> 00:13:56.980
 You know,

00:13:57.019 --> 00:13:57.759
 he rose from the grave.

00:13:57.759 --> 00:13:59.340
 So it's a little ambiguous,

00:14:00.080 --> 00:14:00.220
 but

00:14:00.220 --> 00:14:01.740
 the birthday

00:14:01.740 --> 00:14:02.600
 of Saul Invictus

00:14:02.600 --> 00:14:03.179
 would make

00:14:03.179 --> 00:14:04.159
 sense

00:14:04.159 --> 00:14:05.059
 because

00:14:05.059 --> 00:14:06.519
 and forgive me

00:14:06.519 --> 00:14:07.100
 for being a little

00:14:07.100 --> 00:14:07.960
 astronomical here

00:14:07.960 --> 00:14:08.759
 because

00:14:08.759 --> 00:14:11.159
 December 25th

00:14:11.159 --> 00:14:11.600
 was thought

00:14:11.600 --> 00:14:12.259
 to be the winter

00:14:12.259 --> 00:14:13.019
 solstice

00:14:13.019 --> 00:14:14.179
 in the Roman calendar.

00:14:15.399 --> 00:14:15.840
 Astronomically,

00:14:16.080 --> 00:14:17.059
 it's not actually.

00:14:17.200 --> 00:14:17.899
 It's a few days earlier,

00:14:18.000 --> 00:14:18.679
 but they didn't know that.

00:14:18.819 --> 00:14:19.879
 So it was

00:14:19.879 --> 00:14:20.700
 December 25th.

00:14:20.759 --> 00:14:21.439
 December 25th

00:14:21.439 --> 00:14:22.179
 is the longest

00:14:22.179 --> 00:14:23.819
 night of the year,

00:14:23.879 --> 00:14:24.840
 the shortest day

00:14:24.840 --> 00:14:26.240
 because of the way

00:14:26.240 --> 00:14:26.960
 the Earth

00:14:26.960 --> 00:14:28.360
 rotates around the sun

00:14:28.360 --> 00:14:29.280
 or orbits around the sun

00:14:29.280 --> 00:14:30.360
 and including its tilt

00:14:30.360 --> 00:14:32.200
 in the northern hemisphere

00:14:32.200 --> 00:14:32.639
 at least.

00:14:33.060 --> 00:14:33.420
 And so

00:14:33.420 --> 00:14:34.639
 it makes sense

00:14:34.639 --> 00:14:35.540
 to have a feast

00:14:35.540 --> 00:14:36.360
 of the sun god

00:14:36.360 --> 00:14:37.360
 on the winter solstice

00:14:37.360 --> 00:14:38.180
 because that

00:14:38.180 --> 00:14:38.899
 is when

00:14:38.899 --> 00:14:39.440
 they thought

00:14:39.440 --> 00:14:39.980
 the sun god

00:14:39.980 --> 00:14:40.560
 was born,

00:14:40.720 --> 00:14:41.540
 when light

00:14:41.540 --> 00:14:42.220
 begins to

00:14:42.220 --> 00:14:43.519
 start getting stronger

00:14:43.519 --> 00:14:43.960
 and stronger

00:14:43.960 --> 00:14:44.379
 and stronger

00:14:44.379 --> 00:14:44.759
 and stronger

00:14:44.759 --> 00:14:45.160
 and stronger.

00:14:45.300 --> 00:14:45.720
 So if you're going

00:14:45.720 --> 00:14:46.480
 to pick a day

00:14:46.480 --> 00:14:47.480
 for the sun god

00:14:47.480 --> 00:14:48.040
 to be born,

00:14:48.540 --> 00:14:49.200
 it would be

00:14:49.200 --> 00:14:50.019
 that day.

00:14:50.680 --> 00:14:51.460
 So that's

00:14:51.460 --> 00:14:51.980
 an argument

00:14:51.980 --> 00:14:52.539
 that maybe

00:14:52.539 --> 00:14:53.820
 the chronography

00:14:53.820 --> 00:14:54.680
 of 354

00:14:54.680 --> 00:14:55.600
 did actually

00:14:55.600 --> 00:14:56.500
 refer to the sun god

00:14:56.500 --> 00:14:56.920
 being born

00:14:56.920 --> 00:14:58.139
 on December 25th,

00:14:58.139 --> 00:14:58.860
 which means

00:14:58.860 --> 00:14:59.840
 that our earliest

00:14:59.840 --> 00:15:01.159
 document

00:15:01.159 --> 00:15:02.539
 for the birth

00:15:02.539 --> 00:15:02.980
 of Jesus

00:15:02.980 --> 00:15:04.039
 on December 25th

00:15:04.039 --> 00:15:04.940
 also says

00:15:04.940 --> 00:15:05.580
 the sun god

00:15:05.580 --> 00:15:05.920
 was born

00:15:05.920 --> 00:15:06.960
 on December 25th.

00:15:07.000 --> 00:15:07.680
 It's one of those

00:15:07.680 --> 00:15:08.820
 weird ironies

00:15:08.820 --> 00:15:10.100
 of history.

00:15:10.899 --> 00:15:11.700
 So let's

00:15:11.700 --> 00:15:12.480
 go over

00:15:12.480 --> 00:15:13.519
 what we've found

00:15:13.519 --> 00:15:14.039
 so far.

00:15:14.180 --> 00:15:15.379
 So the chronography

00:15:15.379 --> 00:15:16.240
 of 354

00:15:16.240 --> 00:15:16.680
 was written

00:15:16.680 --> 00:15:17.800
 in 354 A.D.

00:15:18.259 --> 00:15:19.340
 It says clearly

00:15:19.340 --> 00:15:20.159
 Jesus was born

00:15:20.159 --> 00:15:21.080
 on December 25th.

00:15:21.240 --> 00:15:21.560
 But,

00:15:21.559 --> 00:15:22.199
 and this is

00:15:22.199 --> 00:15:22.819
 the earliest

00:15:22.819 --> 00:15:23.839
 undisputed reference

00:15:23.839 --> 00:15:24.739
 to this date.

00:15:25.299 --> 00:15:25.659
 But,

00:15:25.779 --> 00:15:26.919
 it also says

00:15:26.919 --> 00:15:27.539
 this guy

00:15:27.539 --> 00:15:28.319
 Invictus

00:15:28.319 --> 00:15:29.259
 was born

00:15:29.259 --> 00:15:30.699
 on December 25th

00:15:30.699 --> 00:15:32.459
 and that seems

00:15:32.459 --> 00:15:32.839
 to refer

00:15:32.839 --> 00:15:33.559
 to the sun god.

00:15:34.619 --> 00:15:35.239
 Now we've got

00:15:35.239 --> 00:15:35.579
 to connect

00:15:35.579 --> 00:15:36.119
 the dots.

00:15:36.299 --> 00:15:37.299
 Is this coincidental?

00:15:37.559 --> 00:15:38.219
 Is one based

00:15:38.219 --> 00:15:38.779
 on the other?

00:15:38.939 --> 00:15:39.779
 What's going on here?

00:15:39.859 --> 00:15:40.779
 How do we figure

00:15:40.779 --> 00:15:41.559
 out the origin

00:15:41.559 --> 00:15:42.119
 of this day

00:15:42.119 --> 00:15:42.599
 for Jesus?

00:15:43.299 --> 00:15:44.319
 It turns out

00:15:44.319 --> 00:15:44.979
 that if we do

00:15:44.979 --> 00:15:45.539
 some digging

00:15:45.539 --> 00:15:46.899
 into the festival

00:15:46.899 --> 00:15:47.919
 of the sun god

00:15:47.919 --> 00:15:48.719
 Sol Invictus,

00:15:49.019 --> 00:15:49.739
 it's another

00:15:49.739 --> 00:15:51.399
 little irony

00:15:51.399 --> 00:15:52.120
 is that

00:15:52.120 --> 00:15:53.079
 this is also

00:15:53.079 --> 00:15:53.799
 the earliest

00:15:53.799 --> 00:15:54.919
 witness for him

00:15:54.919 --> 00:15:55.639
 having a holiday

00:15:55.639 --> 00:15:56.740
 on December 25th.

00:15:57.539 --> 00:15:58.799
 All the previous

00:15:58.799 --> 00:15:59.459
 testimony

00:15:59.459 --> 00:16:00.620
 about the sun god

00:16:00.620 --> 00:16:01.240
 Invictus,

00:16:01.519 --> 00:16:02.199
 his holidays

00:16:02.199 --> 00:16:02.779
 are on different

00:16:02.779 --> 00:16:03.120
 days.

00:16:03.240 --> 00:16:03.559
 They're not

00:16:03.559 --> 00:16:04.919
 on December 25th.

00:16:04.959 --> 00:16:05.459
 They're on other

00:16:05.459 --> 00:16:06.259
 days in the calendar.

00:16:06.259 --> 00:16:08.759
 So we're kind

00:16:08.759 --> 00:16:09.759
 of at an impasse

00:16:09.759 --> 00:16:10.379
 here because

00:16:10.379 --> 00:16:11.899
 both our earliest

00:16:11.899 --> 00:16:12.759
 pieces of evidence

00:16:12.759 --> 00:16:13.759
 for both come

00:16:13.759 --> 00:16:14.319
 from exactly

00:16:14.319 --> 00:16:15.100
 the same document

00:16:15.100 --> 00:16:15.480
 and were written

00:16:15.480 --> 00:16:16.139
 exactly the same

00:16:16.139 --> 00:16:16.480
 time.

00:16:17.039 --> 00:16:17.620
 So what do we

00:16:17.620 --> 00:16:18.480
 do with this?

00:16:19.159 --> 00:16:20.439
 Why was this

00:16:20.439 --> 00:16:21.580
 chosen for the

00:16:21.580 --> 00:16:22.220
 date of Jesus'

00:16:22.480 --> 00:16:22.779
 birth?

00:16:22.879 --> 00:16:23.399
 Was it based

00:16:23.399 --> 00:16:24.519
 on the birthday

00:16:24.519 --> 00:16:25.319
 of Sol Invictus

00:16:25.319 --> 00:16:25.860
 or maybe some

00:16:25.860 --> 00:16:26.379
 other reasons?

00:16:27.379 --> 00:16:28.019
 Well, this is

00:16:28.019 --> 00:16:28.399
 where we're going

00:16:28.399 --> 00:16:29.559
 to look for a

00:16:29.559 --> 00:16:31.319
 little bit more

00:16:31.319 --> 00:16:32.319
 evidence.

00:16:32.320 --> 00:16:32.860
 And this is

00:16:32.860 --> 00:16:33.180
 going to come

00:16:33.180 --> 00:16:33.620
 from a guy

00:16:33.620 --> 00:16:34.940
 named Hippolytus

00:16:34.940 --> 00:16:35.440
 of Rome.

00:16:35.660 --> 00:16:36.620
 He wrote about

00:16:36.620 --> 00:16:37.600
 100 years before

00:16:37.600 --> 00:16:38.180
 the chronography

00:16:38.180 --> 00:16:39.060
 of 354.

00:16:39.180 --> 00:16:39.640
 He wrote between

00:16:39.640 --> 00:16:41.400
 200 and 235 A.D.

00:16:41.960 --> 00:16:43.220
 I love this guy.

00:16:43.320 --> 00:16:43.860
 I've spent a lot

00:16:43.860 --> 00:16:44.280
 of my time

00:16:44.280 --> 00:16:45.120
 researching him.

00:16:45.480 --> 00:16:46.240
 He wrote

00:16:46.240 --> 00:16:47.520
 several books.

00:16:47.840 --> 00:16:48.379
 He wrote one

00:16:48.379 --> 00:16:49.879
 called A Commentary

00:16:49.879 --> 00:16:50.520
 on Daniel

00:16:50.520 --> 00:16:51.720
 and some other

00:16:51.720 --> 00:16:52.379
 things as well.

00:16:52.600 --> 00:16:53.120
 Here's a picture

00:16:53.120 --> 00:16:53.480
 of it.

00:16:54.000 --> 00:16:55.020
 And in his

00:16:55.020 --> 00:16:56.020
 commentary on Daniel

00:16:56.020 --> 00:16:57.060
 he says something

00:16:57.060 --> 00:16:58.160
 very interesting

00:16:58.160 --> 00:17:00.560
 about the birth

00:17:00.560 --> 00:17:01.280
 of Jesus.

00:17:01.279 --> 00:17:02.759
 He says this,

00:17:03.199 --> 00:17:03.819
 For the first

00:17:03.819 --> 00:17:04.599
 advent of our

00:17:04.599 --> 00:17:05.539
 Lord in the flesh

00:17:05.539 --> 00:17:06.019
 when he was

00:17:06.019 --> 00:17:06.960
 born in Bethlehem

00:17:06.960 --> 00:17:09.519
 was April,

00:17:09.879 --> 00:17:10.200
 March,

00:17:10.339 --> 00:17:11.839
 December 25th.

00:17:13.099 --> 00:17:14.220
 It's kind of weird.

00:17:14.899 --> 00:17:15.279
 Wednesday,

00:17:15.759 --> 00:17:16.500
 while Augustus,

00:17:16.559 --> 00:17:17.099
 that's the emperor,

00:17:17.200 --> 00:17:17.619
 was reigning

00:17:17.619 --> 00:17:18.660
 in his 42nd year

00:17:18.660 --> 00:17:19.139
 but in the

00:17:19.139 --> 00:17:20.639
 5,500th year

00:17:20.639 --> 00:17:21.139
 from Adam.

00:17:21.639 --> 00:17:22.379
 He suffered

00:17:22.379 --> 00:17:23.359
 in the 33rd year

00:17:23.359 --> 00:17:24.259
 so Jesus died

00:17:24.259 --> 00:17:25.180
 in his 33rd year

00:17:25.180 --> 00:17:25.500
 of age,

00:17:25.599 --> 00:17:26.420
 March 25th,

00:17:26.460 --> 00:17:26.819
 a Friday.

00:17:29.519 --> 00:17:30.399
 So it's a little

00:17:30.399 --> 00:17:31.099
 complicated what's

00:17:31.099 --> 00:17:31.480
 going on here.

00:17:31.539 --> 00:17:31.980
 It's also a little

00:17:31.980 --> 00:17:32.379
 weird.

00:17:32.639 --> 00:17:33.539
 So he's trying

00:17:33.539 --> 00:17:34.319
 to give the day

00:17:34.319 --> 00:17:35.259
 for when he thinks

00:17:35.259 --> 00:17:36.199
 Jesus was born

00:17:36.199 --> 00:17:37.659
 but it doesn't

00:17:37.659 --> 00:17:38.699
 really make sense.

00:17:39.079 --> 00:17:39.699
 He says he was

00:17:39.699 --> 00:17:40.559
 born April,

00:17:40.779 --> 00:17:41.079
 March,

00:17:41.219 --> 00:17:41.639
 December.

00:17:42.859 --> 00:17:44.119
 And the reason

00:17:44.119 --> 00:17:45.139
 why is that

00:17:45.139 --> 00:17:46.299
 when you look

00:17:46.299 --> 00:17:47.139
 at this commentary

00:17:47.139 --> 00:17:48.519
 in the manuscripts

00:17:48.519 --> 00:17:49.500
 that we have,

00:17:50.199 --> 00:17:51.379
 they conflict.

00:17:51.740 --> 00:17:52.500
 Some of them say

00:17:52.500 --> 00:17:53.279
 Jesus was born

00:17:53.279 --> 00:17:54.399
 on December 25th.

00:17:54.879 --> 00:17:55.419
 One of them

00:17:55.419 --> 00:17:56.819
 gives this weird

00:17:56.819 --> 00:17:57.639
 double date

00:17:57.639 --> 00:17:58.500
 in the springtime.

00:17:58.500 --> 00:18:00.759
 So the problem

00:18:00.759 --> 00:18:01.299
 is that

00:18:01.299 --> 00:18:03.940
 some copies

00:18:03.940 --> 00:18:04.619
 of his commentary

00:18:04.619 --> 00:18:05.799
 say December 25th,

00:18:05.839 --> 00:18:06.680
 other copies

00:18:06.680 --> 00:18:07.240
 give a different

00:18:07.240 --> 00:18:07.539
 date.

00:18:08.059 --> 00:18:09.599
 If he really

00:18:09.599 --> 00:18:10.420
 did think

00:18:10.420 --> 00:18:11.180
 that it was

00:18:11.180 --> 00:18:12.380
 December 25th,

00:18:12.380 --> 00:18:13.940
 then we would

00:18:13.940 --> 00:18:14.700
 have some

00:18:14.700 --> 00:18:15.680
 great evidence

00:18:15.680 --> 00:18:16.960
 that the birth

00:18:16.960 --> 00:18:17.359
 of Jesus

00:18:17.359 --> 00:18:18.759
 was not chosen

00:18:18.759 --> 00:18:20.079
 based on the

00:18:20.079 --> 00:18:20.700
 feast day

00:18:20.700 --> 00:18:21.339
 of the sun god

00:18:21.339 --> 00:18:22.400
 because Hippolytus

00:18:22.400 --> 00:18:23.640
 wrote about

00:18:23.640 --> 00:18:24.599
 100 years before

00:18:24.599 --> 00:18:25.460
 that date

00:18:25.460 --> 00:18:26.539
 was first witnessed.

00:18:26.539 --> 00:18:27.960
 But we don't

00:18:27.960 --> 00:18:29.099
 know yet

00:18:29.099 --> 00:18:30.460
 because these

00:18:30.460 --> 00:18:31.019
 manuscripts

00:18:31.019 --> 00:18:32.440
 conflict.

00:18:32.599 --> 00:18:32.899
 And actually

00:18:32.899 --> 00:18:33.319
 there's a big

00:18:33.319 --> 00:18:34.079
 footnote explaining

00:18:34.079 --> 00:18:34.440
 all this

00:18:34.440 --> 00:18:34.839
 which I won't

00:18:34.839 --> 00:18:35.319
 go through.

00:18:36.200 --> 00:18:37.799
 But we're

00:18:37.799 --> 00:18:38.559
 kind of at

00:18:38.559 --> 00:18:39.319
 an impasse

00:18:39.319 --> 00:18:40.539
 here again

00:18:40.539 --> 00:18:42.139
 because another

00:18:42.139 --> 00:18:42.980
 date for Christmas

00:18:42.980 --> 00:18:43.920
 on December 25th

00:18:43.920 --> 00:18:44.619
 has conflicting

00:18:44.619 --> 00:18:45.519
 manuscript evidence.

00:18:45.899 --> 00:18:46.299
 We don't know

00:18:46.299 --> 00:18:46.700
 which is the

00:18:46.700 --> 00:18:47.480
 authentic reading

00:18:47.480 --> 00:18:48.379
 so we're at

00:18:48.379 --> 00:18:49.180
 another impasse.

00:18:50.680 --> 00:18:51.779
 He might have

00:18:51.779 --> 00:18:52.259
 said Jesus

00:18:52.259 --> 00:18:52.559
 was born

00:18:52.559 --> 00:18:53.460
 on December 25th.

00:18:53.500 --> 00:18:54.059
 We don't know.

00:18:54.059 --> 00:18:56.200
 So this is

00:18:56.200 --> 00:18:57.119
 where we need

00:18:57.119 --> 00:18:59.039
 another good

00:18:59.039 --> 00:19:00.079
 clue here.

00:19:00.539 --> 00:19:01.259
 And this is

00:19:01.259 --> 00:19:01.819
 going to come

00:19:01.819 --> 00:19:03.700
 from this

00:19:03.700 --> 00:19:06.200
 statue here.

00:19:07.099 --> 00:19:07.879
 This is

00:19:07.879 --> 00:19:09.819
 actually it's

00:19:09.819 --> 00:19:10.119
 one of the

00:19:10.119 --> 00:19:10.639
 most famous

00:19:10.639 --> 00:19:11.659
 Christian artifacts

00:19:11.659 --> 00:19:12.679
 of all time.

00:19:13.279 --> 00:19:14.480
 It seems to

00:19:14.480 --> 00:19:15.679
 be perhaps

00:19:15.679 --> 00:19:16.759
 the earliest

00:19:16.759 --> 00:19:17.980
 piece of

00:19:17.980 --> 00:19:19.000
 Christian archaeology

00:19:19.000 --> 00:19:20.099
 ever discovered

00:19:20.099 --> 00:19:21.200
 that we can

00:19:21.200 --> 00:19:22.279
 definitively date

00:19:22.279 --> 00:19:22.960
 to a specific

00:19:22.960 --> 00:19:23.419
 year.

00:19:23.420 --> 00:19:24.539
 It's called

00:19:24.539 --> 00:19:25.200
 the Statue

00:19:25.200 --> 00:19:25.960
 of Hippolytus.

00:19:26.160 --> 00:19:27.039
 Remember Hippolytus

00:19:27.039 --> 00:19:27.500
 was the guy

00:19:27.500 --> 00:19:27.820
 who wrote

00:19:27.820 --> 00:19:28.400
 that commentary.

00:19:29.039 --> 00:19:29.800
 It sits

00:19:29.800 --> 00:19:30.060
 in the

00:19:30.060 --> 00:19:30.960
 Vatican library

00:19:30.960 --> 00:19:33.519
 and on

00:19:33.519 --> 00:19:34.120
 the side

00:19:34.120 --> 00:19:34.560
 of this

00:19:34.560 --> 00:19:35.080
 statue

00:19:35.080 --> 00:19:36.779
 you can

00:19:36.779 --> 00:19:37.220
 see

00:19:37.220 --> 00:19:38.060
 you probably

00:19:38.060 --> 00:19:38.680
 can't read

00:19:38.680 --> 00:19:39.039
 it but you

00:19:39.039 --> 00:19:39.340
 can see

00:19:39.340 --> 00:19:39.580
 there's

00:19:39.580 --> 00:19:40.220
 inscriptions

00:19:40.220 --> 00:19:41.240
 all over

00:19:41.240 --> 00:19:41.800
 this thing.

00:19:42.660 --> 00:19:42.920
 And

00:19:42.920 --> 00:19:44.320
 these

00:19:44.320 --> 00:19:44.820
 inscriptions

00:19:44.820 --> 00:19:45.400
 date

00:19:45.400 --> 00:19:45.980
 from

00:19:45.980 --> 00:19:48.620
 222

00:19:48.620 --> 00:19:49.060
 AD.

00:19:50.120 --> 00:19:50.620
 And we

00:19:50.620 --> 00:19:51.080
 know that

00:19:51.080 --> 00:19:51.900
 because it

00:19:51.900 --> 00:19:52.259
 says it.

00:19:52.320 --> 00:19:52.620
 It says

00:19:52.619 --> 00:19:53.119
 it was made

00:19:53.119 --> 00:19:53.339
 in the

00:19:53.339 --> 00:19:53.759
 first year

00:19:53.759 --> 00:19:54.179
 of the

00:19:54.179 --> 00:19:54.399
 emperor

00:19:54.399 --> 00:19:54.739
 Alexander

00:19:54.739 --> 00:19:55.199
 Severus

00:19:55.199 --> 00:19:55.459
 that's

00:19:55.459 --> 00:19:56.099
 222

00:19:56.099 --> 00:19:56.299
 AD.

00:19:56.739 --> 00:19:57.279
 And we

00:19:57.279 --> 00:19:57.759
 also know

00:19:57.759 --> 00:19:58.139
 it because

00:19:58.139 --> 00:19:58.479
 what we're

00:19:58.479 --> 00:19:58.859
 looking at

00:19:58.859 --> 00:19:59.259
 here is

00:19:59.259 --> 00:19:59.879
 a calendar

00:19:59.879 --> 00:20:00.959
 and the

00:20:00.959 --> 00:20:01.759
 calendar dates

00:20:01.759 --> 00:20:02.399
 itself to

00:20:02.399 --> 00:20:03.339
 222 AD.

00:20:03.619 --> 00:20:03.959
 So we know

00:20:03.959 --> 00:20:04.239
 that's when

00:20:04.239 --> 00:20:04.659
 it was from

00:20:04.659 --> 00:20:05.439
 and we know

00:20:05.439 --> 00:20:05.759
 that it was

00:20:05.759 --> 00:20:06.759
 by Hippolytus.

00:20:07.579 --> 00:20:08.659
 And in

00:20:08.659 --> 00:20:09.500
 this calendar

00:20:09.500 --> 00:20:10.959
 he says

00:20:10.959 --> 00:20:11.279
 something

00:20:11.279 --> 00:20:11.919
 interesting.

00:20:12.459 --> 00:20:12.939
 These pictures

00:20:12.939 --> 00:20:13.279
 are a little

00:20:13.279 --> 00:20:13.559
 blurry.

00:20:13.699 --> 00:20:14.259
 I have much

00:20:14.259 --> 00:20:14.859
 better pictures

00:20:14.859 --> 00:20:15.459
 but I'm not

00:20:15.459 --> 00:20:15.839
 allowed to

00:20:15.839 --> 00:20:16.359
 show them

00:20:16.359 --> 00:20:17.879
 because I'm

00:20:17.879 --> 00:20:18.239
 not allowed to

00:20:18.239 --> 00:20:18.659
 publish them

00:20:18.659 --> 00:20:19.059
 online.

00:20:19.059 --> 00:20:19.700
 So I have

00:20:19.700 --> 00:20:20.059
 to pick a

00:20:20.059 --> 00:20:20.599
 little blurrier

00:20:20.599 --> 00:20:21.179
 ones here.

00:20:21.700 --> 00:20:22.279
 But what's

00:20:22.279 --> 00:20:22.659
 in this

00:20:22.659 --> 00:20:23.440
 box is

00:20:23.440 --> 00:20:24.440
 actually a

00:20:24.440 --> 00:20:25.399
 statement that

00:20:25.399 --> 00:20:25.759
 I know

00:20:25.759 --> 00:20:26.599
 blurry but

00:20:26.599 --> 00:20:27.419
 it says

00:20:27.419 --> 00:20:28.619
 the

00:20:28.619 --> 00:20:29.159
 Genesis

00:20:29.159 --> 00:20:30.579
 of

00:20:30.579 --> 00:20:31.559
 Christ.

00:20:32.319 --> 00:20:33.519
 In other

00:20:33.519 --> 00:20:33.879
 words in

00:20:33.879 --> 00:20:34.480
 this calendar

00:20:34.480 --> 00:20:35.419
 Hippolytus

00:20:35.419 --> 00:20:36.720
 is marking

00:20:36.720 --> 00:20:37.759
 the day

00:20:37.759 --> 00:20:38.279
 when he

00:20:38.279 --> 00:20:39.319
 thinks the

00:20:39.319 --> 00:20:39.759
 Genesis

00:20:39.759 --> 00:20:41.139
 the original

00:20:41.139 --> 00:20:41.599
 term is

00:20:41.599 --> 00:20:41.980
 Genesis

00:20:41.980 --> 00:20:42.740
 or the

00:20:42.740 --> 00:20:43.240
 birth of

00:20:43.240 --> 00:20:43.740
 Jesus

00:20:43.740 --> 00:20:45.519
 occurred.

00:20:45.519 --> 00:20:46.599
 And if

00:20:46.599 --> 00:20:48.460
 we inscribe

00:20:48.460 --> 00:20:49.440
 this inscription

00:20:49.440 --> 00:20:49.859
 this is what

00:20:49.859 --> 00:20:50.119
 it looks

00:20:50.119 --> 00:20:50.480
 like.

00:20:51.160 --> 00:20:51.480
 And there's

00:20:51.480 --> 00:20:51.859
 where he

00:20:51.859 --> 00:20:52.500
 says the

00:20:52.500 --> 00:20:52.839
 Genesis

00:20:52.839 --> 00:20:53.619
 of Christ.

00:20:55.440 --> 00:20:56.039
 So in

00:20:56.039 --> 00:20:56.440
 other words

00:20:56.440 --> 00:20:56.740
 if we

00:20:56.740 --> 00:20:57.220
 translate

00:20:57.220 --> 00:20:57.940
 this maybe

00:20:57.940 --> 00:20:58.440
 we'll figure

00:20:58.440 --> 00:20:58.859
 out when

00:20:58.859 --> 00:20:59.240
 he thought

00:20:59.240 --> 00:20:59.859
 Hippolytus

00:20:59.859 --> 00:21:00.500
 was born.

00:21:01.220 --> 00:21:01.460
 Maybe

00:21:01.460 --> 00:21:01.900
 he'll say

00:21:01.900 --> 00:21:02.319
 December

00:21:02.319 --> 00:21:03.299
 25th.

00:21:03.799 --> 00:21:04.180
 Maybe

00:21:04.180 --> 00:21:05.099
 this will

00:21:05.099 --> 00:21:05.339
 be the

00:21:05.339 --> 00:21:05.779
 proof.

00:21:06.500 --> 00:21:06.879
 Well let's

00:21:06.879 --> 00:21:07.259
 look at a

00:21:07.259 --> 00:21:08.039
 translation of

00:21:08.039 --> 00:21:08.139
 it.

00:21:08.200 --> 00:21:08.660
 Now I'm

00:21:08.660 --> 00:21:08.779
 going to

00:21:08.779 --> 00:21:09.079
 warn you

00:21:09.079 --> 00:21:09.379
 guys.

00:21:09.839 --> 00:21:10.279
 Unfortunately

00:21:10.279 --> 00:21:10.579
 we're going

00:21:10.579 --> 00:21:10.839
 to have to

00:21:10.839 --> 00:21:11.279
 do a

00:21:11.279 --> 00:21:11.660
 little bit

00:21:11.660 --> 00:21:12.299
 of math

00:21:12.299 --> 00:21:12.639
 here.

00:21:13.079 --> 00:21:13.460
 So just

00:21:13.460 --> 00:21:14.400
 be patient.

00:21:14.400 --> 00:21:16.340
 I'll get

00:21:16.340 --> 00:21:16.700
 you through

00:21:16.700 --> 00:21:16.860
 it.

00:21:16.900 --> 00:21:17.060
 Don't

00:21:17.060 --> 00:21:17.259
 worry.

00:21:17.700 --> 00:21:18.180
 So if

00:21:18.180 --> 00:21:18.700
 we translate

00:21:18.700 --> 00:21:19.360
 this I

00:21:19.360 --> 00:21:19.660
 know the

00:21:19.660 --> 00:21:20.080
 letters are

00:21:20.080 --> 00:21:20.660
 very small

00:21:20.660 --> 00:21:21.620
 here but

00:21:21.620 --> 00:21:22.360
 this is

00:21:22.360 --> 00:21:22.800
 where he

00:21:22.800 --> 00:21:23.320
 talks about

00:21:23.320 --> 00:21:23.620
 the birth

00:21:23.620 --> 00:21:24.040
 of Jesus

00:21:24.040 --> 00:21:24.880
 and I

00:21:24.880 --> 00:21:25.160
 have a

00:21:25.160 --> 00:21:26.259
 note at

00:21:26.259 --> 00:21:26.720
 the bottom

00:21:26.720 --> 00:21:27.240
 the Genesis

00:21:27.240 --> 00:21:27.900
 of Christ

00:21:27.900 --> 00:21:29.740
 and the

00:21:29.740 --> 00:21:30.220
 date it

00:21:30.220 --> 00:21:30.660
 corresponds

00:21:30.660 --> 00:21:32.500
 with is

00:21:32.500 --> 00:21:34.400
 April 2nd.

00:21:37.540 --> 00:21:38.320
 It's kind

00:21:38.320 --> 00:21:38.620
 of a

00:21:38.620 --> 00:21:39.000
 bummer.

00:21:40.600 --> 00:21:41.800
 So yeah

00:21:41.800 --> 00:21:42.540
 so he

00:21:42.540 --> 00:21:43.420
 says very

00:21:43.420 --> 00:21:44.240
 clearly it's

00:21:44.240 --> 00:21:44.920
 totally

00:21:44.920 --> 00:21:45.440
 definitive.

00:21:46.180 --> 00:21:46.599
 He says

00:21:46.599 --> 00:21:46.940
 that the

00:21:46.940 --> 00:21:47.500
 genesis of

00:21:47.500 --> 00:21:47.759
 Jesus

00:21:47.759 --> 00:21:48.759
 happened on

00:21:48.759 --> 00:21:51.140
 April 2nd

00:21:51.140 --> 00:21:51.519
 and if you

00:21:51.519 --> 00:21:51.799
 run the

00:21:51.799 --> 00:21:52.240
 numbers he

00:21:52.240 --> 00:21:52.759
 actually thinks

00:21:52.759 --> 00:21:53.319
 it's 2

00:21:53.319 --> 00:21:53.859
 BC.

00:21:54.140 --> 00:21:54.759
 2 BC

00:21:54.759 --> 00:21:55.700
 April 2nd.

00:21:56.400 --> 00:21:56.940
 He's got

00:21:56.940 --> 00:21:57.480
 other interesting

00:21:57.480 --> 00:21:58.079
 dates here like

00:21:58.079 --> 00:21:58.700
 he puts down

00:21:58.700 --> 00:21:59.140
 when he thinks

00:21:59.140 --> 00:22:00.099
 the Exodus

00:22:00.099 --> 00:22:01.240
 happened when

00:22:01.240 --> 00:22:01.880
 Jesus the

00:22:01.880 --> 00:22:02.420
 passion of

00:22:02.420 --> 00:22:03.160
 Jesus and

00:22:03.160 --> 00:22:04.120
 other things

00:22:04.120 --> 00:22:05.279
 happened as

00:22:05.279 --> 00:22:05.720
 well that we

00:22:05.720 --> 00:22:06.059
 don't have time

00:22:06.059 --> 00:22:06.460
 to go into.

00:22:07.140 --> 00:22:09.960
 But there's

00:22:09.960 --> 00:22:11.059
 still a little

00:22:11.059 --> 00:22:12.279
 puzzle here because

00:22:12.279 --> 00:22:13.640
 what actually does

00:22:13.640 --> 00:22:14.160
 he mean by

00:22:14.160 --> 00:22:14.620
 the Genesis

00:22:14.620 --> 00:22:15.259
 of Christ

00:22:15.259 --> 00:22:15.780
 anyway?

00:22:16.200 --> 00:22:17.180
 Because that

00:22:17.180 --> 00:22:18.200
 term is just

00:22:18.200 --> 00:22:18.740
 the Greek

00:22:18.740 --> 00:22:19.220
 term for

00:22:19.220 --> 00:22:20.060
 origin or

00:22:20.060 --> 00:22:20.440
 beginning.

00:22:20.720 --> 00:22:21.120
 That's where

00:22:21.120 --> 00:22:21.500
 the book of

00:22:21.500 --> 00:22:22.080
 Genesis gets

00:22:22.080 --> 00:22:22.780
 its title from.

00:22:23.200 --> 00:22:23.620
 So the

00:22:23.620 --> 00:22:24.060
 question is

00:22:24.060 --> 00:22:24.820
 what did he

00:22:24.820 --> 00:22:25.340
 think the

00:22:25.340 --> 00:22:25.860
 beginning of

00:22:25.860 --> 00:22:26.980
 Jesus was?

00:22:27.620 --> 00:22:28.420
 Was it his

00:22:28.420 --> 00:22:28.940
 birth?

00:22:29.880 --> 00:22:30.180
 Could it

00:22:30.180 --> 00:22:31.080
 have been

00:22:31.080 --> 00:22:33.040
 something else?

00:22:35.840 --> 00:22:36.440
 What do you

00:22:36.440 --> 00:22:37.100
 guys think?

00:22:39.220 --> 00:22:39.660
 Anyone?

00:22:40.320 --> 00:22:41.059
 I did.

00:22:42.000 --> 00:22:42.720
 Conception.

00:22:43.500 --> 00:22:44.500
 Could it be his

00:22:44.500 --> 00:22:45.140
 conception?

00:22:46.720 --> 00:22:47.180
 Huh.

00:22:47.340 --> 00:22:47.620
 Wait.

00:22:47.759 --> 00:22:48.180
 And what's

00:22:48.180 --> 00:22:48.860
 nine months

00:22:48.860 --> 00:22:49.620
 after April

00:22:49.620 --> 00:22:50.279
 2nd?

00:22:51.059 --> 00:22:51.880
 It's pretty

00:22:51.880 --> 00:22:52.519
 close to

00:22:52.519 --> 00:22:53.900
 December 25th.

00:22:54.660 --> 00:22:55.559
 Well, I

00:22:55.559 --> 00:22:56.220
 actually, one of

00:22:56.220 --> 00:22:56.700
 my earliest

00:22:56.700 --> 00:22:57.519
 research projects

00:22:57.519 --> 00:22:58.120
 was on this

00:22:58.120 --> 00:22:58.820
 very question.

00:22:59.000 --> 00:22:59.660
 What does he

00:22:59.660 --> 00:23:00.400
 mean when he

00:23:00.400 --> 00:23:00.960
 says Genesis

00:23:00.960 --> 00:23:01.440
 of Christ?

00:23:01.539 --> 00:23:01.940
 And if you do

00:23:01.940 --> 00:23:02.620
 a big study

00:23:02.619 --> 00:23:03.239
 and you

00:23:03.239 --> 00:23:04.479
 look at all

00:23:04.479 --> 00:23:05.119
 the writings

00:23:05.119 --> 00:23:05.659
 we have of

00:23:05.659 --> 00:23:06.299
 Hippolytus and

00:23:06.299 --> 00:23:06.879
 you look at all

00:23:06.879 --> 00:23:07.500
 the times he

00:23:07.500 --> 00:23:08.119
 uses the word

00:23:08.119 --> 00:23:08.879
 Genesis to try

00:23:08.879 --> 00:23:09.519
 and figure out

00:23:09.519 --> 00:23:10.299
 what does he

00:23:10.299 --> 00:23:10.639
 think?

00:23:11.059 --> 00:23:11.939
 The evidence is

00:23:11.939 --> 00:23:13.559
 pretty clear that

00:23:13.559 --> 00:23:15.079
 he thought it

00:23:15.079 --> 00:23:15.959
 referred to

00:23:15.959 --> 00:23:16.779
 conception.

00:23:17.839 --> 00:23:19.319
 Meaning that he

00:23:19.319 --> 00:23:20.279
 thought Jesus was

00:23:20.279 --> 00:23:21.079
 not born on

00:23:21.079 --> 00:23:21.699
 April 2nd.

00:23:21.739 --> 00:23:22.379
 He thought Jesus

00:23:22.379 --> 00:23:23.879
 was conceived on

00:23:23.879 --> 00:23:24.679
 April 2nd.

00:23:24.679 --> 00:23:25.139
 That's when the

00:23:25.139 --> 00:23:25.679
 angel Gabriel

00:23:25.679 --> 00:23:26.379
 appeared to Mary

00:23:26.379 --> 00:23:26.839
 in the Gospel

00:23:26.839 --> 00:23:27.299
 of Luke.

00:23:27.979 --> 00:23:28.579
 Which means

00:23:28.579 --> 00:23:30.019
 nine months

00:23:30.019 --> 00:23:30.779
 later, I

00:23:30.779 --> 00:23:31.739
 mean, is

00:23:31.739 --> 00:23:32.279
 like so

00:23:32.279 --> 00:23:33.299
 exactly nine

00:23:33.299 --> 00:23:33.759
 months later

00:23:33.759 --> 00:23:34.759
 is January

00:23:34.759 --> 00:23:35.399
 2nd.

00:23:35.599 --> 00:23:36.220
 But, you

00:23:36.220 --> 00:23:37.539
 know, December

00:23:37.539 --> 00:23:38.339
 25th, it's

00:23:38.339 --> 00:23:39.019
 still possible.

00:23:40.519 --> 00:23:41.240
 So, in other

00:23:41.240 --> 00:23:42.220
 words, we now

00:23:42.220 --> 00:23:42.740
 know when

00:23:42.740 --> 00:23:43.339
 Hippolytus

00:23:43.339 --> 00:23:43.920
 thought Jesus

00:23:43.920 --> 00:23:45.240
 was conceived.

00:23:45.799 --> 00:23:46.359
 We don't

00:23:46.359 --> 00:23:46.899
 know when he

00:23:46.899 --> 00:23:47.539
 thought Jesus

00:23:47.539 --> 00:23:48.720
 was born.

00:23:49.240 --> 00:23:49.579
 But we're

00:23:49.579 --> 00:23:50.180
 close.

00:23:50.420 --> 00:23:51.079
 We're homing

00:23:51.079 --> 00:23:51.599
 in on it,

00:23:51.639 --> 00:23:51.859
 right?

00:23:52.319 --> 00:23:53.379
 What we need

00:23:53.379 --> 00:23:57.099
 is, so, yeah,

00:23:57.139 --> 00:23:58.359
 let me just go

00:23:58.359 --> 00:23:58.879
 over what we've

00:23:58.879 --> 00:23:59.240
 talked about.

00:23:59.319 --> 00:23:59.740
 So, we've

00:23:59.740 --> 00:24:00.619
 talked about the

00:24:00.619 --> 00:24:01.139
 chronography of

00:24:01.139 --> 00:24:01.819
 354.

00:24:01.819 --> 00:24:02.799
 It says Jesus

00:24:02.799 --> 00:24:03.299
 was born on

00:24:03.299 --> 00:24:04.179
 December 25th.

00:24:04.220 --> 00:24:05.139
 It also says

00:24:05.139 --> 00:24:05.599
 this guy

00:24:05.599 --> 00:24:06.679
 Invictus, whoever

00:24:06.679 --> 00:24:07.359
 that is, maybe

00:24:07.359 --> 00:24:07.960
 the sun god,

00:24:08.059 --> 00:24:09.259
 maybe Jesus, was

00:24:09.259 --> 00:24:09.879
 born on December

00:24:09.879 --> 00:24:10.579
 25th.

00:24:11.000 --> 00:24:11.700
 We know that

00:24:11.700 --> 00:24:12.980
 if it is the

00:24:12.980 --> 00:24:13.759
 sun god, this is

00:24:13.759 --> 00:24:14.679
 the earliest date

00:24:14.679 --> 00:24:15.460
 for the festival

00:24:15.460 --> 00:24:16.200
 of the sun god.

00:24:16.419 --> 00:24:18.859
 So, if we want

00:24:18.859 --> 00:24:19.419
 to show that

00:24:19.419 --> 00:24:20.720
 Jesus' birth was

00:24:20.720 --> 00:24:21.480
 not based on

00:24:21.480 --> 00:24:21.899
 this, we've got

00:24:21.899 --> 00:24:22.579
 to go earlier.

00:24:23.599 --> 00:24:24.000
 And now we're

00:24:24.000 --> 00:24:24.379
 talking about

00:24:24.379 --> 00:24:24.859
 this guy,

00:24:25.299 --> 00:24:26.000
 Hippolytus of

00:24:26.000 --> 00:24:26.379
 Rome.

00:24:26.859 --> 00:24:27.659
 He's writing about

00:24:27.659 --> 00:24:28.879
 100 years before

00:24:28.879 --> 00:24:30.099
 the chronography of

00:24:30.099 --> 00:24:30.980
 354, a little

00:24:30.980 --> 00:24:31.500
 more than 100

00:24:31.500 --> 00:24:31.779
 years.

00:24:32.460 --> 00:24:33.460
 He does say

00:24:33.460 --> 00:24:34.120
 Jesus was born

00:24:34.120 --> 00:24:35.039
 on December 25th,

00:24:35.039 --> 00:24:35.440
 but there's

00:24:35.440 --> 00:24:37.900
 manuscript problems.

00:24:38.299 --> 00:24:39.019
 You know, it's

00:24:39.019 --> 00:24:39.680
 unclear if he

00:24:39.680 --> 00:24:40.180
 actually thought

00:24:40.180 --> 00:24:40.380
 that.

00:24:40.740 --> 00:24:41.460
 He definitely,

00:24:41.620 --> 00:24:42.039
 though, thinks

00:24:42.039 --> 00:24:42.740
 that Jesus was

00:24:42.740 --> 00:24:43.480
 conceived on the

00:24:43.480 --> 00:24:44.980
 Passover or early

00:24:44.980 --> 00:24:45.440
 April.

00:24:46.440 --> 00:24:47.460
 I should go back

00:24:47.460 --> 00:24:47.940
 to this little

00:24:47.940 --> 00:24:48.640
 calendar here.

00:24:48.920 --> 00:24:49.819
 All these dates

00:24:49.819 --> 00:24:51.120
 correspond with the

00:24:51.120 --> 00:24:51.500
 Passover.

00:24:51.500 --> 00:24:51.640
 Passover.

00:24:51.859 --> 00:24:52.640
 And so, when he

00:24:52.640 --> 00:24:53.799
 says Jesus was

00:24:53.799 --> 00:24:54.660
 born on April 2nd,

00:24:54.660 --> 00:24:55.960
 he's also stating

00:24:55.960 --> 00:24:57.039
 that Jesus was,

00:24:57.519 --> 00:24:58.279
 when he says Jesus

00:24:58.279 --> 00:24:59.119
 was conceived on

00:24:59.119 --> 00:25:00.339
 April 2nd, he's

00:25:00.339 --> 00:25:01.160
 also saying that

00:25:01.160 --> 00:25:02.559
 Jesus was conceived

00:25:02.559 --> 00:25:03.420
 on the Passover.

00:25:04.140 --> 00:25:06.720
 So, okay, that's

00:25:06.720 --> 00:25:07.660
 where we are now.

00:25:08.400 --> 00:25:10.019
 We're almost there.

00:25:10.119 --> 00:25:11.220
 We're almost there

00:25:11.220 --> 00:25:12.200
 to December 25th.

00:25:12.240 --> 00:25:13.019
 We need a little

00:25:13.019 --> 00:25:14.000
 bit more evidence.

00:25:14.619 --> 00:25:16.380
 Well, this evidence

00:25:16.380 --> 00:25:18.099
 comes from another

00:25:18.099 --> 00:25:19.480
 work of Hippolytus.

00:25:19.599 --> 00:25:20.380
 Hippolytus was one

00:25:20.380 --> 00:25:21.640
 of these, like, he

00:25:21.640 --> 00:25:22.540
 thought math could

00:25:22.540 --> 00:25:23.180
 prove a lot of

00:25:23.180 --> 00:25:23.420
 stuff.

00:25:23.520 --> 00:25:24.580
 So, he wrote this

00:25:24.580 --> 00:25:25.340
 kind of mathematical

00:25:25.340 --> 00:25:26.080
 and chronological

00:25:26.080 --> 00:25:28.240
 work, and in it, he

00:25:28.240 --> 00:25:30.020
 says that Jesus was

00:25:30.020 --> 00:25:33.060
 born nine months after

00:25:33.060 --> 00:25:34.720
 the anniversary of the

00:25:34.720 --> 00:25:35.460
 creation of the

00:25:35.460 --> 00:25:35.720
 world.

00:25:37.100 --> 00:25:38.380
 But he doesn't give

00:25:38.380 --> 00:25:40.120
 us when he thought

00:25:40.120 --> 00:25:41.200
 the world was

00:25:41.200 --> 00:25:41.680
 created.

00:25:41.980 --> 00:25:42.820
 Hippolytus is what

00:25:42.820 --> 00:25:43.400
 we would call a

00:25:43.400 --> 00:25:43.960
 young earther.

00:25:44.120 --> 00:25:44.800
 Like, he believed

00:25:44.800 --> 00:25:45.820
 the earth was

00:25:45.820 --> 00:25:47.160
 literally made in

00:25:47.160 --> 00:25:49.320
 six days, six 24-hour

00:25:49.320 --> 00:25:49.640
 days.

00:25:49.640 --> 00:25:52.000
 And he, the earth

00:25:52.000 --> 00:25:52.980
 was about 6,000,

00:25:53.060 --> 00:25:54.020
 5,000-something years

00:25:54.020 --> 00:25:54.320
 old.

00:25:54.780 --> 00:25:55.880
 And there were other

00:25:55.880 --> 00:25:56.400
 people in the early

00:25:56.400 --> 00:25:57.300
 church that believed

00:25:57.300 --> 00:25:57.540
 that.

00:25:57.620 --> 00:25:58.240
 There were others that

00:25:58.240 --> 00:25:59.180
 didn't, just like

00:25:59.180 --> 00:25:59.580
 today.

00:26:00.500 --> 00:26:02.100
 But he thought the

00:26:02.100 --> 00:26:03.160
 world was created on a

00:26:03.160 --> 00:26:04.680
 specific calendar day,

00:26:04.900 --> 00:26:06.000
 and that whatever day

00:26:06.000 --> 00:26:07.780
 that was, nine months

00:26:07.780 --> 00:26:10.580
 later, Jesus was born on

00:26:10.580 --> 00:26:11.660
 the anniversary of that

00:26:11.660 --> 00:26:12.300
 day.

00:26:12.560 --> 00:26:13.680
 In other words, if we

00:26:13.680 --> 00:26:15.240
 can figure out when

00:26:15.240 --> 00:26:16.320
 Hippolytus thought the

00:26:16.320 --> 00:26:18.040
 world was created, then

00:26:18.039 --> 00:26:19.379
 we just add nine months

00:26:19.379 --> 00:26:19.879
 and we get the

00:26:19.879 --> 00:26:20.680
 birthday of Jesus.

00:26:20.680 --> 00:26:21.039
 Okay?

00:26:21.220 --> 00:26:22.299
 I know it sounds weird,

00:26:22.299 --> 00:26:23.500
 and it's kind of like

00:26:23.500 --> 00:26:24.899
 mental acrobatics, and

00:26:24.899 --> 00:26:26.399
 that's because it's what

00:26:26.399 --> 00:26:26.720
 it is.

00:26:26.779 --> 00:26:27.819
 This is what Hippolytus is

00:26:27.819 --> 00:26:28.079
 doing.

00:26:28.180 --> 00:26:28.940
 He loved this kind of

00:26:28.940 --> 00:26:29.259
 stuff.

00:26:29.460 --> 00:26:30.659
 So he's throwing all

00:26:30.659 --> 00:26:31.519
 these numbers around.

00:26:32.000 --> 00:26:33.700
 So the problem is

00:26:33.700 --> 00:26:35.379
 Hippolytus never really

00:26:35.379 --> 00:26:38.180
 says when he thought the

00:26:38.180 --> 00:26:38.980
 world was created.

00:26:39.059 --> 00:26:39.740
 He doesn't just come out

00:26:39.740 --> 00:26:41.799
 and say it, but he does

00:26:41.799 --> 00:26:43.039
 tell us how to figure it

00:26:43.039 --> 00:26:43.279
 out.

00:26:43.279 --> 00:26:46.220
 And all we have to do

00:26:46.220 --> 00:26:48.379
 is start, he gives us

00:26:48.379 --> 00:26:50.059
 the formula, we start

00:26:50.059 --> 00:26:52.799
 with the conception of

00:26:52.799 --> 00:26:54.759
 Jesus, and we go back

00:26:54.759 --> 00:26:58.899
 5,500 years, I think it's

00:26:58.899 --> 00:27:02.299
 5,502 years, to find the

00:27:02.299 --> 00:27:04.319
 day when the world was

00:27:04.319 --> 00:27:05.160
 created in his little

00:27:05.160 --> 00:27:05.799
 calendar here.

00:27:06.420 --> 00:27:08.619
 And notice that there are

00:27:08.619 --> 00:27:09.440
 some dates here.

00:27:09.519 --> 00:27:10.039
 So what we're going to do

00:27:10.039 --> 00:27:10.539
 is we're going to start

00:27:10.539 --> 00:27:11.180
 here, and we're just going

00:27:11.180 --> 00:27:12.400
 to cycle through these,

00:27:12.660 --> 00:27:13.299
 and we're going to do

00:27:13.299 --> 00:27:15.160
 5,502 steps.

00:27:15.600 --> 00:27:17.240
 And when we get to here,

00:27:17.299 --> 00:27:17.900
 we're going to start

00:27:17.900 --> 00:27:18.940
 again and just keep going

00:27:18.940 --> 00:27:20.779
 until we get 5,502 years.

00:27:21.200 --> 00:27:23.360
 And notice that there is

00:27:23.360 --> 00:27:25.920
 a March 25th date.

00:27:26.539 --> 00:27:28.220
 So if we land on that

00:27:28.220 --> 00:27:30.600
 date, that would be when

00:27:30.600 --> 00:27:33.340
 Hippolytus thought the

00:27:33.340 --> 00:27:35.299
 world was created, and then

00:27:35.299 --> 00:27:36.420
 nine months from that date

00:27:36.420 --> 00:27:38.600
 is December 25th.

00:27:38.599 --> 00:27:40.500
 So it's possible.

00:27:40.959 --> 00:27:42.279
 So let's see if we can

00:27:42.279 --> 00:27:42.859
 make it happen.

00:27:42.980 --> 00:27:44.419
 So if we run the numbers

00:27:44.419 --> 00:27:46.379
 and we start here, and we

00:27:46.379 --> 00:27:48.959
 do 5,502 steps to see what

00:27:48.959 --> 00:27:50.519
 date we're going to come up

00:27:50.519 --> 00:27:50.779
 with.

00:27:51.240 --> 00:27:54.959
 Oh, we come up here, March

00:27:54.959 --> 00:27:56.500
 29th.

00:27:57.819 --> 00:27:59.980
 Oh, that was close, though,

00:28:00.039 --> 00:28:00.379
 guys.

00:28:00.459 --> 00:28:01.399
 It was pretty close.

00:28:02.519 --> 00:28:04.240
 Well, there's another little

00:28:04.240 --> 00:28:04.980
 wrinkle here.

00:28:05.339 --> 00:28:05.980
 There's another little

00:28:05.980 --> 00:28:06.379
 wrinkle here.

00:28:06.380 --> 00:28:07.500
 I know this calendar is

00:28:07.500 --> 00:28:08.660
 small and it's hard to see.

00:28:09.020 --> 00:28:09.780
 The problem is I've got to

00:28:09.780 --> 00:28:10.800
 have it all on the screen,

00:28:10.940 --> 00:28:11.740
 otherwise it won't work

00:28:11.740 --> 00:28:12.100
 properly.

00:28:12.660 --> 00:28:14.760
 But there's another wrinkle

00:28:14.760 --> 00:28:14.980
 here.

00:28:15.320 --> 00:28:16.640
 So remember that I said that

00:28:16.640 --> 00:28:17.440
 this was a Passover

00:28:17.440 --> 00:28:17.900
 calendar?

00:28:18.180 --> 00:28:19.100
 He's trying to figure out

00:28:19.100 --> 00:28:20.120
 when various Passovers

00:28:20.120 --> 00:28:20.440
 occurred.

00:28:20.580 --> 00:28:22.060
 So he thinks the world was

00:28:22.060 --> 00:28:23.160
 created on or near the

00:28:23.160 --> 00:28:24.700
 Passover, et cetera, et

00:28:24.700 --> 00:28:24.800
 cetera.

00:28:25.200 --> 00:28:26.480
 Well, there's something

00:28:26.480 --> 00:28:27.160
 interesting here.

00:28:27.360 --> 00:28:30.780
 So this number 5 here means

00:28:30.780 --> 00:28:32.880
 that it refers to the 5th day

00:28:32.880 --> 00:28:33.340
 of the week.

00:28:33.420 --> 00:28:33.820
 What is that?

00:28:33.819 --> 00:28:34.039
 Is that?

00:28:35.480 --> 00:28:36.700
 I'm really bad here, people.

00:28:36.839 --> 00:28:37.679
 Is that Friday or Thursday?

00:28:37.799 --> 00:28:38.939
 Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday,

00:28:39.079 --> 00:28:39.379
 Thursday.

00:28:39.879 --> 00:28:40.200
 Thursday.

00:28:40.419 --> 00:28:40.879
 Okay, Thursday.

00:28:41.220 --> 00:28:43.019
 So he thinks the world was

00:28:43.019 --> 00:28:44.119
 created on a Thursday,

00:28:44.379 --> 00:28:44.799
 apparently.

00:28:45.220 --> 00:28:46.939
 And it was March 29th of

00:28:46.939 --> 00:28:47.279
 Thursday.

00:28:47.439 --> 00:28:48.559
 Well, it turns out, if you do

00:28:48.559 --> 00:28:50.139
 a little more reading, that

00:28:50.139 --> 00:28:53.279
 that's actually when he thinks

00:28:53.279 --> 00:28:54.939
 the moon was created.

00:28:54.939 --> 00:28:55.980
 Because you can't have a

00:28:55.980 --> 00:28:57.139
 Passover without the moon.

00:28:57.259 --> 00:28:58.299
 Because the Passover happens

00:28:58.299 --> 00:28:59.099
 on the full moon.

00:28:59.099 --> 00:29:00.899
 So he thinks that's when the

00:29:00.899 --> 00:29:01.719
 moon was created.

00:29:02.719 --> 00:29:04.480
 And then if we go back,

00:29:05.359 --> 00:29:07.899
 four, no, when was the moon

00:29:07.899 --> 00:29:08.799
 created in Genesis?

00:29:08.959 --> 00:29:09.539
 What day of the week?

00:29:09.579 --> 00:29:12.759
 If we go back, we get to

00:29:12.759 --> 00:29:15.240
 March 25th, day one, Sunday.

00:29:16.099 --> 00:29:17.699
 Meaning that he did think the

00:29:17.699 --> 00:29:19.419
 world was created on March 25th.

00:29:19.420 --> 00:29:24.200
 So, actually, it's a little,

00:29:24.259 --> 00:29:26.019
 okay, yes, it's far-fetched.

00:29:26.200 --> 00:29:28.000
 But remember, we're not talking

00:29:28.000 --> 00:29:29.500
 about whether Jesus was actually

00:29:29.500 --> 00:29:30.240
 born on this day.

00:29:30.360 --> 00:29:32.160
 We're talking about where this

00:29:32.160 --> 00:29:33.200
 belief came from.

00:29:33.600 --> 00:29:36.259
 And this was Hippolytus' belief,

00:29:36.300 --> 00:29:38.380
 that he thought that the world

00:29:38.380 --> 00:29:41.100
 was kind of this cosmic ballad

00:29:41.100 --> 00:29:42.759
 that witnessed to God's creation.

00:29:42.759 --> 00:29:44.480
 And that God liked to create

00:29:44.480 --> 00:29:45.519
 things on the Passover and

00:29:45.519 --> 00:29:46.220
 vernal equinox.

00:29:46.560 --> 00:29:48.720
 He created the world on the

00:29:48.720 --> 00:29:49.400
 vernal equinox.

00:29:49.480 --> 00:29:50.740
 The Passover was five days

00:29:50.740 --> 00:29:51.080
 later.

00:29:51.620 --> 00:29:52.660
 You go throughout history,

00:29:52.779 --> 00:29:55.080
 all these various biblically

00:29:55.080 --> 00:29:56.720
 impressive events, like the

00:29:56.720 --> 00:29:57.600
 exodus occurred on the

00:29:57.600 --> 00:29:58.779
 Passover, the genesis of

00:29:58.779 --> 00:29:59.980
 Christ, the death of Jesus.

00:30:00.279 --> 00:30:01.460
 All these things happened on

00:30:01.460 --> 00:30:02.460
 the Passover, he thought.

00:30:03.160 --> 00:30:04.539
 So, in other words, we go

00:30:04.539 --> 00:30:05.800
 through our little, all our

00:30:05.800 --> 00:30:07.100
 data points here, and we can

00:30:07.100 --> 00:30:10.019
 add one more, that Jesus was

00:30:10.019 --> 00:30:12.180
 born nine months after the

00:30:12.180 --> 00:30:13.140
 anniversary of the creation of

00:30:13.140 --> 00:30:14.920
 the world, which was March

00:30:14.920 --> 00:30:16.900
 25th, and then nine months

00:30:16.900 --> 00:30:18.880
 later is, of course, December

00:30:18.880 --> 00:30:19.500
 25th.

00:30:20.060 --> 00:30:23.280
 So, in other words, this is

00:30:23.280 --> 00:30:25.000
 probably how we got the date of

00:30:25.000 --> 00:30:26.000
 December 25th.

00:30:27.440 --> 00:30:29.180
 Hippolytus seems to have settled

00:30:29.180 --> 00:30:32.440
 on this because of, he thought

00:30:32.440 --> 00:30:33.760
 that Jesus was conceived on the

00:30:33.760 --> 00:30:35.280
 Passover, the world was created on

00:30:35.280 --> 00:30:38.140
 March 25th, and he added in this

00:30:38.140 --> 00:30:40.180
 nine-month kind of gestational

00:30:40.180 --> 00:30:41.380
 period, because, of course, Jesus

00:30:41.380 --> 00:30:42.780
 being perfect would have had

00:30:42.780 --> 00:30:45.300
 exactly nine-month gestation,

00:30:45.299 --> 00:30:45.599
 right?

00:30:45.919 --> 00:30:46.799
 No more, no less.

00:30:47.519 --> 00:30:49.220
 What's also interesting is that

00:30:49.220 --> 00:30:51.419
 once we figure this out about

00:30:51.419 --> 00:30:54.839
 Hippolytus, we figure out that

00:30:54.839 --> 00:30:57.740
 other Christians pretty much said

00:30:57.740 --> 00:30:58.399
 the same thing.

00:30:58.879 --> 00:31:01.339
 This guy, Julius Africanus, in 221,

00:31:01.759 --> 00:31:04.419
 he has the same fundamental

00:31:04.419 --> 00:31:05.839
 assumptions that Hippolytus has

00:31:05.839 --> 00:31:06.799
 about the birth of Jesus.

00:31:07.879 --> 00:31:10.099
 Clement of Alexandria in 195, he's

00:31:10.099 --> 00:31:12.200
 got the same stuff going on, where

00:31:12.200 --> 00:31:13.860
 he thinks there's this Passover

00:31:13.860 --> 00:31:14.340
 link.

00:31:14.460 --> 00:31:15.580
 Jesus was conceived on the

00:31:15.580 --> 00:31:17.539
 Passover, born nine months later.

00:31:17.900 --> 00:31:19.019
 Nine months after the Passover,

00:31:19.160 --> 00:31:20.880
 remember the Passover, like Easter,

00:31:21.000 --> 00:31:21.980
 moves around on the calendar.

00:31:22.480 --> 00:31:24.539
 Nine months after it is always

00:31:24.539 --> 00:31:25.880
 around December 25th.

00:31:25.900 --> 00:31:27.299
 It's always roughly around there.

00:31:27.580 --> 00:31:29.680
 So, in other words, it's not just

00:31:29.680 --> 00:31:30.660
 Hippolytus doing this.

00:31:30.720 --> 00:31:32.299
 There's other early Christians that

00:31:32.299 --> 00:31:34.640
 are doing this as well.

00:31:35.440 --> 00:31:37.680
 And that helps us to answer our

00:31:37.680 --> 00:31:38.960
 question, was Christmas originally

00:31:38.960 --> 00:31:40.700
 chosen because it corresponded with

00:31:40.700 --> 00:31:41.440
 a pagan holiday?

00:31:42.660 --> 00:31:43.519
 Not really.

00:31:44.019 --> 00:31:46.660
 It was because certain early

00:31:46.660 --> 00:31:49.140
 Christians had this belief that the

00:31:49.140 --> 00:31:51.299
 angel Gabriel appeared to Mary on

00:31:51.299 --> 00:31:51.779
 the Passover.

00:31:52.100 --> 00:31:53.759
 And that's when they believed Jesus

00:31:53.759 --> 00:31:56.100
 was conceived, and they thought that

00:31:56.100 --> 00:31:58.080
 Jesus was therefore conceived nine

00:31:58.080 --> 00:31:59.640
 months later, so they figured, all I

00:31:59.640 --> 00:32:02.580
 got to do is figure out when Gabriel

00:32:02.580 --> 00:32:05.200
 appeared to Mary, and add exactly nine

00:32:05.200 --> 00:32:06.080
 months, because of course he would have

00:32:06.080 --> 00:32:07.180
 had a perfect nine-month justational

00:32:07.180 --> 00:32:09.000
 period, and we get his birthday.

00:32:09.000 --> 00:32:12.380
 And it also explains why the early

00:32:12.380 --> 00:32:14.019
 Christian dates for Christmas are

00:32:14.019 --> 00:32:14.779
 always a little different.

00:32:14.920 --> 00:32:16.119
 Some said December 25th.

00:32:16.160 --> 00:32:17.759
 Some say early January.

00:32:18.440 --> 00:32:20.640
 I think there's one that's mid-December.

00:32:21.099 --> 00:32:22.359
 And that's because if this is what

00:32:22.359 --> 00:32:24.240
 they're doing, they're always landing

00:32:24.240 --> 00:32:25.900
 nine months after the Passover, which

00:32:25.900 --> 00:32:29.920
 is approximately when, around December

00:32:29.920 --> 00:32:31.400
 25th, give or take a couple weeks.

00:32:33.839 --> 00:32:34.400
 Amos.

00:32:34.400 --> 00:32:36.880
 Were you saying that there's a link

00:32:36.880 --> 00:32:38.780
 between the equinox and the Passover,

00:32:39.080 --> 00:32:39.660
 like the timing?

00:32:40.000 --> 00:32:40.340
 Yeah.

00:32:40.480 --> 00:32:41.740
 So the question is, is there a link

00:32:41.740 --> 00:32:43.240
 between the Passover and the equinox?

00:32:43.360 --> 00:32:43.680
 Yes.

00:32:44.200 --> 00:32:46.380
 So, well, I won't show, I won't go all

00:32:46.380 --> 00:32:46.740
 the way back.

00:32:46.840 --> 00:32:51.840
 But there's a link because in the Bible,

00:32:51.840 --> 00:32:54.940
 I think the phrase is like, the Passover

00:32:54.940 --> 00:32:57.300
 should be celebrated on the first full moon

00:32:57.300 --> 00:32:59.720
 of the new year, and the new year is

00:32:59.720 --> 00:33:03.080
 marked, I think, when something becomes

00:33:03.079 --> 00:33:04.460
 ripe or something, and that was later

00:33:04.460 --> 00:33:06.000
 interpreted as the vernal equinox.

00:33:06.559 --> 00:33:08.699
 So Passover was always supposed to be

00:33:08.699 --> 00:33:11.359
 on the first full moon after the vernal

00:33:11.359 --> 00:33:11.919
 equinox.

00:33:12.039 --> 00:33:15.019
 And then we celebrate Easter on the first

00:33:15.019 --> 00:33:18.119
 Sunday after the Passover, because Jesus

00:33:18.119 --> 00:33:20.159
 was crucified on or near the Passover, and

00:33:20.159 --> 00:33:22.439
 then was resurrected the following Sunday.

00:33:22.859 --> 00:33:25.240
 So the vernal equinox, it's one of those

00:33:25.240 --> 00:33:28.419
 things where most ancient traditions and

00:33:28.419 --> 00:33:30.539
 religions have some celebration with the

00:33:30.539 --> 00:33:31.119
 vernal equinox.

00:33:31.119 --> 00:33:34.319
 Because it's when light begins to outshine

00:33:34.319 --> 00:33:34.839
 darkness.

00:33:35.419 --> 00:33:37.579
 Where the winter solstice is when light

00:33:37.579 --> 00:33:38.899
 starts getting stronger.

00:33:39.059 --> 00:33:40.719
 It's been getting less and less and less

00:33:40.719 --> 00:33:41.539
 for the past three months.

00:33:41.779 --> 00:33:44.639
 So there is a connection between the vernal

00:33:44.639 --> 00:33:47.019
 equinox and the Passover, because the

00:33:47.019 --> 00:33:50.919
 vernal equinox will, if you just do a lunar

00:33:50.919 --> 00:33:53.779
 cycle, so you're just counting 13 lunar cycles

00:33:53.779 --> 00:33:55.979
 in every year, eventually your lunar calendar

00:33:55.979 --> 00:33:59.019
 will just completely get disconnected to your

00:33:59.019 --> 00:34:01.639
 solar calendar.

00:34:01.639 --> 00:34:03.180
 So they insert an intercalary month, so it

00:34:03.180 --> 00:34:04.940
 never goes much beyond the vernal equinox.

00:34:05.220 --> 00:34:07.059
 So every few years they stick in an extra

00:34:07.059 --> 00:34:07.639
 lunar month.

00:34:07.859 --> 00:34:09.099
 And yeah.

00:34:09.199 --> 00:34:09.960
 Does that answer your question?

00:34:10.739 --> 00:34:13.539
 Yeah, because it sounds like, it might be

00:34:13.539 --> 00:34:15.719
 fair to say that, so you said Sol Invictus'

00:34:15.900 --> 00:34:20.300
 birth was on the winter solstice.

00:34:20.659 --> 00:34:20.840
 Yeah.

00:34:20.840 --> 00:34:24.039
 So in that sense, and it sounds like what

00:34:24.039 --> 00:34:27.120
 you're saying is that in an approximate way,

00:34:27.260 --> 00:34:30.660
 Jesus' birth also correspond or was derived

00:34:30.660 --> 00:34:31.980
 based on the solar calendar.

00:34:32.480 --> 00:34:34.920
 So in a sense, both, you know, maybe for

00:34:34.920 --> 00:34:38.920
 different pathways through the reasoning, both

00:34:38.920 --> 00:34:44.180
 Jesus and Sol Invictus' birthday originate or was

00:34:44.180 --> 00:34:45.920
 derived from the solar calendar.

00:34:46.519 --> 00:34:46.760
 Yes.

00:34:46.960 --> 00:34:47.280
 Yes.

00:34:47.360 --> 00:34:48.000
 Actually, yes.

00:34:48.000 --> 00:34:51.260
 So you can make an argument that the birth of

00:34:51.260 --> 00:34:53.940
 Sol Invictus has to do with the solar calendar

00:34:53.940 --> 00:34:55.179
 and when the vernal equinox happened.

00:34:55.920 --> 00:34:57.800
 There are similar considerations going on with

00:34:57.800 --> 00:35:00.679
 Jesus, but they're not saying, well, we want

00:35:00.679 --> 00:35:02.239
 the day that Sol Invictus has.

00:35:02.599 --> 00:35:05.039
 They're saying, hey, God created the heavens

00:35:05.039 --> 00:35:08.179
 and the earth, and we think Jesus was conceived

00:35:08.179 --> 00:35:09.920
 on the vernal equinox, therefore he's going to

00:35:09.920 --> 00:35:10.039
 be.

00:35:10.280 --> 00:35:13.079
 So that's, so yes, there's a parallel, parallel

00:35:13.079 --> 00:35:14.179
 reasonings going on.

00:35:14.239 --> 00:35:16.519
 They're both looking to the, to the sun and the

00:35:16.519 --> 00:35:18.559
 moon to figure out when to put things.

00:35:19.179 --> 00:35:20.699
 But the Bible does that too.

00:35:20.800 --> 00:35:22.820
 And we're supposed to, the Bible says God created

00:35:22.820 --> 00:35:26.440
 the sun and the moon to mark times and it's

00:35:26.440 --> 00:35:27.139
 created by God.

00:35:27.199 --> 00:35:29.980
 And so we're comfortable using the moon and sun to

00:35:29.980 --> 00:35:30.960
 mark our calendars.

00:35:31.519 --> 00:35:35.900
 This is also, by the way, Hippolytus is following

00:35:35.900 --> 00:35:37.159
 the Roman calendar here.

00:35:37.219 --> 00:35:40.679
 You guys may have picked up that December 25th is not

00:35:40.679 --> 00:35:42.420
 actually the winter solstice.

00:35:42.420 --> 00:35:44.780
 The Romans thought it was, but it's not.

00:35:44.880 --> 00:35:46.000
 It's actually a few days earlier.

00:35:46.500 --> 00:35:48.720
 Well, Clement, the Egyptians had a better calendar.

00:35:48.880 --> 00:35:51.320
 So their winter solstice is more accurate,

00:35:51.460 --> 00:35:52.340
 astronomically speaking.

00:35:52.720 --> 00:35:56.539
 So his, his date of Jesus's birth is a little bit

00:35:56.539 --> 00:35:58.099
 different, but it's because he's following a

00:35:58.099 --> 00:36:00.960
 different calendar where his winter solstice and

00:36:00.960 --> 00:36:02.980
 vernal equinox were on different, were on

00:36:02.980 --> 00:36:03.579
 different days.

00:36:05.119 --> 00:36:06.440
 Although his were a little more accurate.

00:36:06.940 --> 00:36:09.680
 So I still want to ask a question though.

00:36:09.679 --> 00:36:12.139
 When was Jesus actually born?

00:36:12.919 --> 00:36:15.619
 So we've talked about when, when Hippolytus thought

00:36:15.619 --> 00:36:17.299
 Jesus was born and when some other people thought

00:36:17.299 --> 00:36:20.559
 Jesus was born, but when was he actually born?

00:36:22.159 --> 00:36:26.719
 And it would be really nice if the Bible just told us,

00:36:26.779 --> 00:36:26.980
 right?

00:36:27.000 --> 00:36:29.319
 If Luke just came out or Matthew just came out and

00:36:29.319 --> 00:36:31.759
 just said, Oh yeah, it was, it was this day, but

00:36:31.759 --> 00:36:32.259
 they don't.

00:36:33.039 --> 00:36:34.219
 Or do they?

00:36:34.219 --> 00:36:39.759
 Well, let's go to the gospel of Luke.

00:36:39.859 --> 00:36:41.839
 Maybe he's hidden something in there that we can use.

00:36:42.000 --> 00:36:45.299
 If we go to the gospel of Luke, why did my, my

00:36:45.299 --> 00:36:47.859
 PowerPoint just, just went.

00:36:49.559 --> 00:36:49.919
 Okay.

00:36:49.980 --> 00:36:50.399
 There it is.

00:36:50.480 --> 00:36:51.379
 I don't know what was happening there.

00:36:52.000 --> 00:36:55.059
 So we go to the gospel of Luke and he tells us something.

00:36:55.259 --> 00:36:58.719
 He says in Luke chapter one, 13 through 17, he says that

00:36:58.719 --> 00:37:02.719
 an angel tells Zechariah that Elizabeth is going to

00:37:02.719 --> 00:37:03.439
 conceive a son.

00:37:03.839 --> 00:37:04.119
 Okay.

00:37:04.159 --> 00:37:05.359
 Remember that it's going to be important.

00:37:05.500 --> 00:37:06.919
 This is going to be John the Baptist, right?

00:37:07.199 --> 00:37:09.879
 John the Baptist is going to be, he, he receives this

00:37:09.879 --> 00:37:12.539
 message while he's in the temple doing temple service.

00:37:12.539 --> 00:37:13.239
 He's a priest.

00:37:13.639 --> 00:37:17.379
 And the angel says, your wife's going to conceive a

00:37:17.379 --> 00:37:17.599
 son.

00:37:18.259 --> 00:37:24.939
 Then I'm not sure why there's these delays going on here.

00:37:25.139 --> 00:37:26.379
 So then Luke goes on.

00:37:26.379 --> 00:37:30.539
 He says that Mary, the angel Gabriel appears to Mary six

00:37:30.539 --> 00:37:34.800
 months after Elizabeth had conceived John the Baptist.

00:37:35.099 --> 00:37:36.420
 And he's very clear on that.

00:37:36.460 --> 00:37:37.179
 He says six months.

00:37:37.259 --> 00:37:42.759
 So that means that Jesus is, therefore we can assume that

00:37:42.759 --> 00:37:46.539
 Mary gives birth to Jesus six months after Elizabeth gives

00:37:46.539 --> 00:37:47.860
 birth to John the Baptist.

00:37:48.039 --> 00:37:52.159
 In other words, Jesus is six months older than John or younger

00:37:52.159 --> 00:37:53.340
 than John the Baptist, right?

00:37:53.800 --> 00:37:55.179
 There's a six months difference.

00:37:55.179 --> 00:38:00.879
 So if we can figure out when John the Baptist was born or when

00:38:00.879 --> 00:38:04.819
 he was conceived, maybe we can figure out when Jesus was

00:38:04.819 --> 00:38:06.119
 born, right?

00:38:07.019 --> 00:38:09.659
 So there's another piece of evidence.

00:38:10.460 --> 00:38:14.339
 Luke says that Zechariah was a priest and that he was in the

00:38:14.339 --> 00:38:16.119
 priestly course of Abijah.

00:38:16.699 --> 00:38:19.839
 Every priest was put in various courses and they would have their

00:38:19.839 --> 00:38:21.179
 two week rotation in the temple.

00:38:21.639 --> 00:38:22.579
 Your two weeks would come up.

00:38:22.819 --> 00:38:24.319
 You'd get called to do your temple service.

00:38:24.320 --> 00:38:24.900
 Two weeks come up.

00:38:24.920 --> 00:38:25.840
 You could call to do temple service.

00:38:25.960 --> 00:38:27.080
 And it was very regimented.

00:38:27.620 --> 00:38:31.780
 So if we can figure out when the course of Abijah was serving in

00:38:31.780 --> 00:38:38.920
 the temple, hey, maybe we can figure out when Jesus was born.

00:38:39.460 --> 00:38:44.220
 I've got some scholarly friends of mine who are big believers in

00:38:44.220 --> 00:38:44.680
 this theory.

00:38:44.960 --> 00:38:47.300
 And they've written some articles on this.

00:38:47.380 --> 00:38:52.160
 And you can try and reconstruct when the course of Abijah was

00:38:52.159 --> 00:38:52.539
 happening.

00:38:53.059 --> 00:38:59.159
 And there are some people that claim that Abijah was in the

00:38:59.159 --> 00:39:00.079
 course of Abijah.

00:39:00.199 --> 00:39:04.539
 So the priests, including Zechariah, would have been in the temple in

00:39:04.539 --> 00:39:06.259
 mid to late September.

00:39:07.500 --> 00:39:09.379
 So I'm sorry, we're going to have to do the math again.

00:39:09.380 --> 00:39:14.180
 So that's when, if he's in there mid to late September, six months after that,

00:39:14.780 --> 00:39:15.900
 Jesus is conceived.

00:39:16.099 --> 00:39:19.420
 Well, six months after mid-September is mid-late March.

00:39:19.660 --> 00:39:23.940
 And then born nine months later is mid to late December.

00:39:24.460 --> 00:39:26.880
 Now, there are some people that maintain this.

00:39:26.880 --> 00:39:31.640
 I don't really buy it.

00:39:32.640 --> 00:39:34.579
 There's a lot of assumptions going into this.

00:39:34.680 --> 00:39:41.280
 So first of all, the number six, Luke does say six months, but it's like, you know, this

00:39:41.280 --> 00:39:44.840
 could be five and a half months, six and a half months.

00:39:45.360 --> 00:39:47.380
 He doesn't necessarily mean exactly six months.

00:39:47.800 --> 00:39:53.000
 And then even if he did, who's, I mean, we don't know if Jesus actually had a

00:39:53.000 --> 00:39:54.480
 perfect nine months gestational period.

00:39:54.480 --> 00:39:58.159
 There's nothing, I mean, he doesn't, maybe he was born nine and a half months later.

00:39:58.260 --> 00:39:59.719
 Maybe he was born eight months later.

00:40:00.139 --> 00:40:06.780
 And then we also don't know that this is when Elizabeth, where is my thing here?

00:40:07.159 --> 00:40:12.820
 That we're assuming that Elizabeth and conceived John the Baptist, you know, the day the angel

00:40:12.820 --> 00:40:15.280
 told this to Zechariah, but there's no indication of this.

00:40:15.340 --> 00:40:16.260
 It could have been months later.

00:40:16.360 --> 00:40:17.000
 We don't know.

00:40:17.579 --> 00:40:23.880
 And then this whole course of Abijah thing, you know, the reality is I, we just don't really

00:40:23.880 --> 00:40:27.619
 know when the course of Abijah would have been serving in the temple.

00:40:28.140 --> 00:40:29.800
 There's some speculation.

00:40:30.619 --> 00:40:36.180
 The problem is that we know that the high priests at this time were not always following

00:40:36.180 --> 00:40:37.200
 the law correctly.

00:40:37.640 --> 00:40:39.440
 We know that exceptions were made all the time.

00:40:39.500 --> 00:40:40.280
 Like we just don't know.

00:40:40.760 --> 00:40:45.300
 There's no, if we did have a document that, you know, literally said and was very clear,

00:40:45.500 --> 00:40:48.640
 I could believe it, but we don't have good documentation for this.

00:40:48.639 --> 00:40:54.039
 So in other words, I don't really buy it.

00:40:54.279 --> 00:40:55.500
 You guys are free to buy it.

00:40:55.599 --> 00:40:56.239
 Some people do.

00:40:56.420 --> 00:40:57.079
 That's fine.

00:40:57.480 --> 00:40:58.699
 I don't really buy it.

00:40:59.519 --> 00:41:03.719
 But traditionally, this is one of the ways people have tried to figure out when Jesus

00:41:03.719 --> 00:41:07.379
 was actually born is if we could figure out when this guy was in the temple and then we

00:41:07.379 --> 00:41:09.779
 have these other assumptions, then maybe we could figure it out.

00:41:11.019 --> 00:41:13.339
 So when was Jesus actually born?

00:41:13.340 --> 00:41:25.519
 Well, I don't know, but I have to say that if I was going to pick something, it is interesting

00:41:25.519 --> 00:41:31.539
 that Luke does say twice when he's referring to the birth of Jesus, he says, Mary treasured

00:41:31.539 --> 00:41:34.220
 up all these things, pondering them in her heart.

00:41:35.240 --> 00:41:39.940
 And I certainly got to believe that the angel Gabriel appearing to her and telling her that

00:41:39.940 --> 00:41:43.740
 she was going to be the mother of God's son would have been a pretty big deal.

00:41:44.179 --> 00:41:48.420
 And she would have remembered that and would have remembered the date that that happened.

00:41:48.639 --> 00:41:52.519
 And it is interesting that of all the dates we've been talking about, the birth of Jesus,

00:41:52.639 --> 00:41:57.820
 the conception of Jesus, the thing that is rock solid in early Christian tradition, everybody

00:41:57.820 --> 00:42:01.800
 agrees that this happened on the Passover.

00:42:01.800 --> 00:42:07.760
 It's the earliest tradition we have, and it's also the most widespread and universal tradition.

00:42:07.760 --> 00:42:14.840
 And so that is probably what I would hang my hat on if I had to, is I'd be like, there's

00:42:14.840 --> 00:42:19.760
 just this really, really early tradition that's very universal that this happened on the Passover

00:42:19.760 --> 00:42:25.660
 and nine months after the Passover is around late December, early January.

00:42:25.840 --> 00:42:26.800
 That's when it is around.

00:42:27.500 --> 00:42:31.420
 So was Jesus born on December 25th?

00:42:31.740 --> 00:42:32.640
 There's a chance.

00:42:34.440 --> 00:42:35.560
 We'll find out one day.

00:42:37.760 --> 00:42:39.040
 All right, guys.

00:42:39.700 --> 00:42:44.440
 Thanks for sitting through some calendrical math and astronomical speculation.

00:42:45.160 --> 00:42:48.480
 If you guys have questions, I'd be happy to answer them.

00:42:51.940 --> 00:42:54.940
 Yeah, the first thing Callie said was, uh-oh, when I raised my hand.

00:42:56.800 --> 00:42:58.740
 So, Tom, this is so interesting, man.

00:42:58.780 --> 00:42:59.900
 As always, great job.

00:43:00.240 --> 00:43:00.660
 Love it.

00:43:00.659 --> 00:43:07.179
 As far as the birth of Jesus goes dating that, the only way I'd really look at this before

00:43:07.179 --> 00:43:12.960
 was through the star and through astronomical evidence.

00:43:12.960 --> 00:43:17.699
 And I read a book some time ago by a guy named Mike Molnar called The Star of Bethlehem.

00:43:18.259 --> 00:43:23.679
 And he talks about, walks you through very systematically, like what would the Magi have seen to cause them

00:43:23.679 --> 00:43:29.819
 to believe and understand that this amazing king was born, you know, in the ancient Near East.

00:43:29.819 --> 00:43:38.079
 And based off of that, that pretty much concludes that Jupiter would have been part of that and where everything was.

00:43:38.199 --> 00:43:41.980
 And that caused the date, I think it was around early April.

00:43:41.980 --> 00:43:48.300
 Now, do you have anything to say about data that comes from the astronomical side of this?

00:43:48.539 --> 00:43:50.380
 So, I have read that also.

00:43:50.860 --> 00:43:54.840
 I've read that also, that there were these astronomical considerations.

00:43:55.659 --> 00:43:58.000
 It's true that that's what the Magi were looking at.

00:43:58.059 --> 00:43:59.159
 Matthew talks about a star.

00:43:59.400 --> 00:44:03.340
 That word for star, though, could be a star, could be a planet, could be a comet,

00:44:03.519 --> 00:44:06.039
 could be any kind of meteorological phenomenon.

00:44:06.039 --> 00:44:12.380
 And the idea is that there is this aligning of planets and maybe a constellation, too.

00:44:12.500 --> 00:44:13.039
 I don't know.

00:44:13.699 --> 00:44:14.519
 Yeah, it was a constellation.

00:44:14.539 --> 00:44:15.559
 That was all aligned.

00:44:17.960 --> 00:44:20.699
 So, I remember, I'm not an astronomer.

00:44:20.840 --> 00:44:22.820
 So, I'm just like, okay, that sounds good.

00:44:23.079 --> 00:44:27.679
 I will say that biblically, though, it's very unclear when the Magi actually show up.

00:44:28.320 --> 00:44:31.239
 And so, we know that they see this star.

00:44:31.239 --> 00:44:36.199
 I think what the most interesting, and this is kind of speculative, but the most interesting

00:44:36.199 --> 00:44:40.919
 thing they're dealing with is they're not just seeing the star, but they're looking at,

00:44:41.219 --> 00:44:46.239
 they're from Babylon or Babylonia, the greater area, and that had a Jewish presence for hundreds

00:44:46.239 --> 00:44:46.939
 and hundreds of years.

00:44:47.199 --> 00:44:52.079
 And there's a prophecy in the Old Testament that a star will rise out of, is it Jacob or

00:44:52.079 --> 00:44:52.339
 Judah?

00:44:53.159 --> 00:44:57.399
 And that maybe they're thinking of that and they're seeing this, whatever it is they're

00:44:57.399 --> 00:44:57.739
 seeing.

00:44:57.739 --> 00:45:05.000
 And, but because we don't really know when they're seeing this alignment and what, or

00:45:05.000 --> 00:45:12.159
 even specifically what it is they're seeing, I just, I think it's hard to pinpoint an actual

00:45:12.159 --> 00:45:14.699
 day that, remember, we've got to be so specific.

00:45:14.899 --> 00:45:17.239
 If we want December 25th, we've got to land on a day.

00:45:17.659 --> 00:45:24.439
 And ancient astronomers sometimes were shockingly good, but other times they weren't good at

00:45:24.440 --> 00:45:24.539
 all.

00:45:24.659 --> 00:45:29.480
 Like, like this calendar of Hippolytus, part of the reason that we know when it was written

00:45:29.480 --> 00:45:30.740
 is because it's wrong.

00:45:31.400 --> 00:45:36.380
 Because it's actually only, it says, it says it was written in the year 222.

00:45:36.800 --> 00:45:40.200
 And when you run the numbers astronomically and you compare it to the lunar cycle, you

00:45:40.200 --> 00:45:44.179
 realize it's actually only accurate for a few years before and after 222 AD.

00:45:44.179 --> 00:45:47.699
 So we know we have double confirmation of when it was written.

00:45:48.199 --> 00:45:51.539
 So he was, Hippolytus was actually a pretty poor astronomer.

00:45:52.159 --> 00:45:58.739
 I'm assuming the Magi would have been better, but it just, even if we knew the constellation,

00:45:59.799 --> 00:46:03.699
 you'd still have to show that they were aware of it as well.

00:46:03.719 --> 00:46:06.919
 Because like I said, the Romans themselves couldn't get the solstice right.

00:46:07.039 --> 00:46:08.599
 They were a few days off from the solstice.

00:46:08.960 --> 00:46:09.719
 They knew it was there.

00:46:09.719 --> 00:46:11.599
 So I guess I'm still skeptical.

00:46:12.659 --> 00:46:18.779
 I remember reading this thing about Revelation and the woman closed with the sun and the

00:46:18.779 --> 00:46:20.759
 moon and 12 stars on her head.

00:46:20.919 --> 00:46:24.659
 And there's apparently this astronomical phenomenon where these constellations all align.

00:46:24.899 --> 00:46:26.000
 It's really fascinating.

00:46:26.719 --> 00:46:30.319
 And it might be true, maybe.

00:46:31.259 --> 00:46:31.500
 I don't know.

00:46:34.659 --> 00:46:35.819
 Oh, do you want to follow up?

00:46:35.819 --> 00:46:37.480
 I've got a kind of learning check real quick.

00:46:37.480 --> 00:46:46.719
 It sounds like the ideas for the December 25th date were around in 1st, 2nd century, 3rd

00:46:46.719 --> 00:46:49.699
 century, but popularized in 354, right?

00:46:49.820 --> 00:46:51.400
 When that calendar.

00:46:52.079 --> 00:46:52.320
 Okay.

00:46:52.500 --> 00:46:53.199
 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:46:53.360 --> 00:46:53.539
 Yeah.

00:46:53.559 --> 00:46:54.579
 Really when it went popular?

00:46:55.119 --> 00:46:55.960
 That's a great question.

00:46:56.119 --> 00:47:02.840
 So the fundamental assumptions that led to the December 25th date are certainly around in

00:47:02.840 --> 00:47:03.600
 the 2nd century.

00:47:05.360 --> 00:47:10.320
 And we see them first explicitly in the early 3rd century.

00:47:11.019 --> 00:47:15.600
 We see some of the assumptions even as early as the 2nd century.

00:47:16.420 --> 00:47:20.300
 So in the 2nd century, we see traditions that Jesus was conceived on the Passover.

00:47:20.480 --> 00:47:21.840
 So that's already in the 100s.

00:47:21.840 --> 00:47:30.940
 And then in the early 200s, we see that Jesus was actually born on December 25th, but there's

00:47:30.940 --> 00:47:31.820
 a variety of traditions.

00:47:32.660 --> 00:47:40.079
 And then in the 3rd or the 4th century, the 300s, December 25th starts becoming more and

00:47:40.079 --> 00:47:40.579
 more popular.

00:47:40.900 --> 00:47:43.800
 But there's still alternative traditions, even then.

00:47:43.800 --> 00:47:50.340
 And it takes a while for things to settle down and get to December 25th universally.

00:47:51.539 --> 00:47:52.200
 Thank you.

00:47:52.539 --> 00:47:53.700
 Very interesting talk.

00:47:54.220 --> 00:47:57.420
 But I'm kind of looking at it from a different angle.

00:47:57.640 --> 00:48:03.019
 I mean, Christians were, when we initially started, Christians were pretty much, they're

00:48:03.019 --> 00:48:06.039
 the hunted kind of a group of people at that time.

00:48:06.280 --> 00:48:06.560
 Yeah.

00:48:06.559 --> 00:48:12.320
 And we know that from the Bible that, you know, Jesus' birth is sometime during the winter

00:48:12.320 --> 00:48:12.639
 months.

00:48:12.900 --> 00:48:14.360
 Not in the summer months, but in the winter months.

00:48:15.539 --> 00:48:20.099
 What do you think about the, you know, general, you know, assumption that maybe it was done

00:48:20.099 --> 00:48:25.340
 because it was a safe time to celebrate, you know, being a Christian, able to celebrate

00:48:25.340 --> 00:48:27.840
 at the same time and kind of mixing with the...

00:48:27.840 --> 00:48:28.440
 Oh, I see.

00:48:28.539 --> 00:48:28.779
 I see.

00:48:28.820 --> 00:48:29.079
 I see.

00:48:29.179 --> 00:48:31.299
 So the idea is that Christians are being persecuted.

00:48:31.300 --> 00:48:38.680
 And if they have this holiday where they're celebrating, then it might mark them as Christians

00:48:38.680 --> 00:48:39.940
 and they might suffer more persecution.

00:48:40.140 --> 00:48:45.140
 But if they celebrate when other people, other people following the Roman religion are celebrating,

00:48:45.240 --> 00:48:46.140
 then they won't stick out.

00:48:46.240 --> 00:48:46.519
 Exactly.

00:48:46.640 --> 00:48:48.039
 So that people will find...

00:48:48.039 --> 00:48:50.000
 And then through time, it becomes tradition.

00:48:50.539 --> 00:48:50.720
 Yeah.

00:48:50.800 --> 00:48:51.680
 And then through time, it becomes tradition.

00:48:52.240 --> 00:48:53.140
 It's possible.

00:48:53.280 --> 00:48:54.039
 It's definitely possible.

00:48:54.200 --> 00:48:57.840
 A lot of this is kind of speculation on our part.

00:48:57.840 --> 00:49:03.760
 But I will say that Hippolytus, the guy who wrote this calendar, this guy was as zealous

00:49:03.760 --> 00:49:10.000
 as you can possibly imagine and was more anti-pagan than you can really imagine.

00:49:10.160 --> 00:49:15.559
 To the point where in his commentary, he has this prayer where he's talking about Shadrach,

00:49:15.640 --> 00:49:17.680
 Meshach, and Abednego being thrown in the fiery furnace.

00:49:18.480 --> 00:49:22.579
 And he says, you know, this happens today where people are brought before tribunals and

00:49:22.579 --> 00:49:23.840
 they're tortured and they're put to death.

00:49:23.840 --> 00:49:30.200
 And he has this prayer where he says, Lord, please make me a witness like them.

00:49:30.700 --> 00:49:32.680
 And 15 years later, he was martyred.

00:49:32.940 --> 00:49:34.240
 He was executed for his faith.

00:49:35.039 --> 00:49:41.800
 So he does not seem like the kind of guy that would want to snuggle up with, you know,

00:49:42.340 --> 00:49:44.600
 under the penumbra of a pagan holiday.

00:49:44.800 --> 00:49:47.140
 He urges people, be open with your faith.

00:49:47.559 --> 00:49:49.480
 You know, be willing to make the good confession.

00:49:49.480 --> 00:49:54.099
 So at least with him, I don't think that probably would have happened.

00:49:54.179 --> 00:49:58.960
 My impression from other early Christian writers is they were a zealous bunch.

00:49:59.099 --> 00:50:01.800
 They probably would not have wanted to do that.

00:50:02.599 --> 00:50:03.579
 But it is possible.

00:50:04.380 --> 00:50:08.719
 I've actually, so I've presented one view of this whole astronomical view, but there are

00:50:08.719 --> 00:50:11.980
 other views like, and none of them are mutually exclusive.

00:50:12.219 --> 00:50:14.960
 Like someone could believe that and this at the same time.

00:50:14.960 --> 00:50:16.559
 And it just, it just all agrees.

00:50:16.740 --> 00:50:22.980
 There's another view in there's some early sermons where they talk about on December 25th,

00:50:22.980 --> 00:50:26.380
 they talk about the son of righteousness appears with healing in his wings.

00:50:27.039 --> 00:50:31.900
 And that could then get back to the whole winter solstice idea that Jesus is the son of righteousness.

00:50:32.440 --> 00:50:36.380
 He rises with healing in his wings like the solar sun.

00:50:36.519 --> 00:50:38.400
 And they're picking that day because of that.

00:50:38.400 --> 00:50:44.380
 There's another, there's another idea that, that it's like a very literal reading of Luke

00:50:44.380 --> 00:50:47.019
 where Luke says Jesus was about to be 30 years old.

00:50:47.099 --> 00:50:51.960
 And so they try and they say he must be literally 30 years old, like not a single day more or less.

00:50:52.000 --> 00:50:53.539
 And they try and do all these calculations on that.

00:50:53.860 --> 00:51:01.340
 So there's various views, but most of them come back to this, some kind of calendrical futzing about.

00:51:01.480 --> 00:51:02.820
 They believe something with the calendar.

00:51:02.820 --> 00:51:11.160
 In other words, none of them, they're not really saying we heard from tradition that Jesus was born on December 25th.

00:51:11.680 --> 00:51:14.980
 They're giving these other reasons to arrive at that date.

00:51:16.200 --> 00:51:17.080
 If that makes sense.

00:51:17.320 --> 00:51:20.820
 There may be one, one exception to that rule, but okay.

00:51:22.220 --> 00:51:23.340
 I don't mean to be a downer.

00:51:23.400 --> 00:51:25.500
 If you guys want to believe he was born on December 25th, that's great.

00:51:25.640 --> 00:51:26.680
 So that's totally fine.

00:51:26.800 --> 00:51:27.840
 I hope he was.

00:51:28.280 --> 00:51:30.980
 I joyfully celebrate his birth on December 25th.

00:51:30.980 --> 00:51:32.680
 So I'm excited about it.

00:51:32.820 --> 00:51:33.840
 Another question, Clay?

00:51:35.620 --> 00:51:38.080
 Understanding check again and walking away.

00:51:38.220 --> 00:51:48.360
 Is it more to do with the perfect nine months after the creation of the world or the perfect nine months after Mary gets the news at Passover?

00:51:48.700 --> 00:51:51.880
 So which one is kind of the more governing of the two?

00:51:52.019 --> 00:51:52.280
 Yes.

00:51:52.500 --> 00:51:53.120
 Great question.

00:51:53.119 --> 00:52:05.380
 Well, I think when it comes to Hippolytus, that he wasn't the greatest astronomer.

00:52:05.599 --> 00:52:07.819
 He wasn't the greatest mathematician either.

00:52:07.820 --> 00:52:13.800
 So he may not have sorted that out in his mind, that distinction, which you very perceptively pointed out.

00:52:14.340 --> 00:52:26.100
 And the reason why is because if you really look at this calendar and dig into it, you'll note that he says things like, for instance, he'll say, this is when the Exodus happened on note H.

00:52:26.099 --> 00:52:28.940
 And you can go find note H in the calendar.

00:52:28.940 --> 00:52:35.019
 But then he's got another statement where he says, well, this is when the Exodus happened according to Daniel.

00:52:35.019 --> 00:52:39.199
 And this is when the Passover of Joshua happened on note D.

00:52:39.300 --> 00:52:42.440
 But then you see this is when Joshua according to Daniel happened.

00:52:42.940 --> 00:52:47.639
 What's going on here is that Hippolytus has done his biblical chronology.

00:52:47.780 --> 00:52:49.440
 He's gone through the historical books of the Bible.

00:52:49.599 --> 00:52:50.900
 He's tried to find all these Passovers.

00:52:51.320 --> 00:52:55.119
 But then he had this peculiar view about Daniel and his prophecy.

00:52:55.440 --> 00:52:56.840
 And they were contradictory.

00:52:57.179 --> 00:52:58.300
 He couldn't make them match.

00:52:58.300 --> 00:53:05.680
 So he just laid down completely contradictory dates in his calendar just openly and just said these things apparently occurred twice.

00:53:05.680 --> 00:53:10.039
 Like there were there were two Exodus Passovers, even though there's only one.

00:53:10.340 --> 00:53:15.360
 Anyway, my point is that he did not mind living in contradiction.

00:53:15.880 --> 00:53:21.880
 And so that nine month issue of whether it was exactly nine months from creation or exactly nine months from conception,

00:53:21.880 --> 00:53:27.180
 I think he probably just would have been he probably didn't really sort it out.

00:53:28.300 --> 00:53:29.180
 Does that make sense?

00:53:30.140 --> 00:53:30.660
 Thank you.

00:53:31.840 --> 00:53:32.740
 There are others.

00:53:32.840 --> 00:53:38.380
 You see other people juggling with stuff where they'll say that, no, Jesus wasn't crucified on.

00:53:38.480 --> 00:53:46.320
 Because what they they try to do this perfect life balance where Jesus is crucified and conceived on the same day, the Passover.

00:53:46.700 --> 00:53:48.800
 But you'll see others saying, no, no, no, no, no.

00:53:48.800 --> 00:53:53.060
 He was conceived on the Passover, but he was resurrected on the vernal equinox.

00:53:53.060 --> 00:53:57.140
 And they start doing all this stuff for the vernal equinox and Passover going back and forth.

00:53:57.139 --> 00:54:01.659
 But they're always pivoting around that idea that he was conceived on the Passover.

00:54:01.819 --> 00:54:04.079
 That's the consistent idea.

00:54:04.299 --> 00:54:06.279
 Sometimes the Passover is on the vernal equinox.

00:54:06.339 --> 00:54:07.339
 Sometimes it's near it.

00:54:07.659 --> 00:54:10.519
 Sometimes he dies on the Passover and vernal equinox.

00:54:10.599 --> 00:54:12.659
 Sometimes he is resurrected on the vernal equinox.

00:54:12.659 --> 00:54:24.879
 It just depends on how they're doing their jiggering and then how they want to then fast forward nine months to find December or December 25th, January 2nd, January 7th, whatever date, whatever date they have in mind.

00:54:24.880 --> 00:54:29.539
 All right, guys.

00:54:29.660 --> 00:54:32.539
 Well, let's why don't I wrap up with just a word of prayer.

00:54:32.539 --> 00:54:41.000
 Father in heaven, we thank you that you have left your witnesses in the heavens to your glory with the sun and the moon.

00:54:42.099 --> 00:54:48.199
 Father, as the darkness is growing in this season, I pray that we would remember the birth of your son.

00:54:48.199 --> 00:54:56.139
 Father, we read in scripture that he is the day spring who will arise and shine on the darkness of our souls.

00:54:56.359 --> 00:55:03.500
 And we ask that, Lord, you would forgive us of our sins and that as we remember his birth, that we would love others.

00:55:03.799 --> 00:55:05.219
 We would humbly serve them.

00:55:05.460 --> 00:55:12.579
 We would declare your gospel, God, that we would rejoice at salvation that has been given to us so freely and so perfectly.

00:55:12.579 --> 00:55:15.340
 And we pray this in the mighty name of Jesus.

00:55:16.480 --> 00:55:16.739
 Amen.