Lesson 15, Daniel 10

[0:00] Daniel 10, and I'm going to, again, go back and look at the review screens for just a second. Again, we've got our three kings in the book of Daniel, Nebuchadnezzar, Belshazzar, Darius, or Cyrus, and you can see where the different chapters fall and whose rule and reign those chapters happen during.

[0:26] And chapters 10, 11, 12 are at the end of the book. They're also in Darius's rule in the third year. And the reason I put 10, 11, 12 together is because they all go together.

[0:37] They're one big unit. It's kind of chapter 10. Well, we'll get to that in a second. But they're one big unit, and so that's why they're all together.

[0:47] So that's just how the chapters flow. Then I've been showing you a chart that has the three time periods. Well, I've updated the chart to have four time periods since Michelle said something about it the other day.

[1:01] And Randy, here's them. Good night. Good night. So what I've done is obviously this is Babylon, and this is their time periods.

[1:15] Really, this is the – that's not right, is it? Yeah, that's right. And then Persia comes next. Then Greece, as well as Greece being split into four.

[1:27] And then basically Rome picks up at about this period of time. Even though Rome starts before there, this is sort of when, you know, history begins to see them. And 70 A.D. is the destruction of the temple in Jerusalem.

[1:39] So that's the time periods, the things that sort of happen there. And if you go back to Daniel chapter 2, you have the gold, silver, bronze, iron, and clay. So that shows you which kingdom that goes to.

[1:51] Chapter 7 is the lion-eagle monster, the bear monster, the leopard, four wings and heads, and then the monstrous beast with the seven horns. So try to represent that as well.

[2:03] So when we hit chapter 8, chapter 8 was basically about these two periods of time, kind of roughly speaking. And then chapter 9 was basically roughly speaking from about this point to here, about 70 A.D.

[2:25] That's kind of what that's talking about. And then our chapter 10, 11, and 12 starts kind of looking here in the split of the four kingdoms and goes to 70 A.D. as well.

[2:36] So that's just kind of the time period that it covers. Does that make sense? When you say it covers it, you mean it's the time period that the prophecies in it pointed to? Yes. Okay. Yes. Yeah, that's what I mean.

[2:47] The prophecies in these visions pointed to this section of time. And like 8 pointed to this section of time. Okay. That's what I meant by that.

[2:58] And I probably shouldn't have done arrows. I probably should have done like little flat lines because anyway, it makes it look like it goes on forever if you're a math person. Okay.

[3:10] Infinity lines. So before we read chapter 10, I want to show you this as well. Chapter 10, 11, and 12, again, it's that one vision. And basically what happens is that in chapter 10, you meet the messenger that Daniel's going to hear from.

[3:26] Chapter 11, and obviously it overlaps the chapter divisions. This is where the message is told. And then chapter 12 is sort of the final commands that Daniel gets after everything has been explained.

[3:42] And so that's how that sort of shapes up. So tonight, really, we're just going to be looking at the messenger. We'll probably go ahead and read through verse 20 just to, or 21 actually, just to put it all together.

[3:53] But does that make sense, kind of what we're looking at then? We're going to look at the messenger first, then the message, and then the final comments. So Daniel chapter 10, beginning in verse 1 then.

[4:06] Do I have anybody who's interested in reading a little bit? I can read some. I read a few chapters. Okay. Verses, okay. Verses, I'm sorry.

[4:17] In the third year of Cyrus, king of Persia, a thing was revealed unto Daniel, whose name was called Belphi. And the thing was true. But the time appointed was long, and he understood the thing.

[4:29] And had understood and had understanding of the thing. In those days, I, Daniel, was mourning three full weeks. I ate no pleasant bread. Neither came flesh, no wine in my mouth.

[4:41] Neither did I anoint myself at all, till three whole weeks were fulfilled. And in the fourth and twentieth day of the first month, as I was by the side of the great river, which is a decadal, hmm.

[4:55] Or a decadal? I've got tigress. My translation's got tigress, so I'm not sure. Then I lifted up my eyes, and looked, and behold, a certain man clothed in men.

[5:07] His loins were girded with fine gold of uphats. His body also was like the barrel. And his face, and the appearance of lightning, and his eyes, and the plants of fire.

[5:20] And his arms, and his feet, like in colored polished brass. And the voice of his words, like the voice of a multitude. And I, Daniel, alone saw the vision.

[5:31] For the men that were with me saw not the vision, but a great quaking fell upon them, so that they fled to hide themselves. Therefore I was left alone, and saw the great vision.

[5:43] And there remained no strength of me. For my comeliness was turned to me into corruption, and I retained no strength. Yet heard I the voice of his words.

[5:53] And when I heard the voice of his words, then was I in a deep sleep on my face, and my face tore the ground. Okay. Is that good, or do you want to go a little further?

[6:08] I was thinking of what? Oh, it is. So I have the same King James, and so mine has the head decal, but over here has the notation that it's a tiger. No, there it is.

[6:19] That's right. Hmm. That's cool. And behold, a hand touched me, which set me upon my knee, and upon the palms of my hand.

[6:31] And he said unto me, O Daniel, a man greatly beloved, understand the words that I speak unto thee, and stand upright. For unto thee am I now since, and when he hath spoken his word unto me, I stood to him.

[6:47] Then said he unto me, Fear not, Daniel, for from the first day that thou didst set thy heart to understand, and to chasten myself before thy God, thy words were heard, and I come for thy words.

[7:03] But the prince of the kingdom of Persia was still there in one at times a day. The little Michael and one of the chief princes came to help me, and I remained there with the kingdom of Persia.

[7:15] Now I am come to make thee understand that what shall befall thy people in the latter days. For yet the vision is for many days.

[7:26] And when he had spoken such words unto me, I set my face toward the ground, and I came down. And behold, one like the simulatism of the sun to the moon touched my lips, that I opened my mouth, and spake, and said unto him that stood before me, O my Lord, by thy vision my sorrows are turned upon me, and I have retained no strength.

[7:52] For how can the servants of this, my Lord, talk with this, my Lord? For as for me, straightway there remained no strength in me, neither is there a breath left with me.

[8:04] Then there came again, and touched me one like the appearance of man, and he strengthened me, and said, O man greatly beloved, fear not, peace be unto thee, be strong, ye be strong.

[8:20] And when he had spoken unto me, I was strengthened, and said, let my Lord speak, for thou hast strength in me. Then said he, knowest thou wherefore I come unto thee, and know will I return to fight with the prince of Persia.

[8:35] And when I am gone forth, lo, the prince of Grisha shall come. But I will assure thee that which is noted in the scripture of truth, and there is none that holdeth me in these things, but my holy prince.

[8:50] Okay. Wow. So nice little vision there, things that we see there. To kind of set the stage for us of where we're headed with this, you know, one of the things that Daniel has been seeing is that, yes, as people return to the land, but also, yes, the people are going to abandon God again.

[9:15] And a lot of that abandoning of God is going to be a result of the pressures of the culture around them, because different kingdoms are going to come and go through Jerusalem, and people are going to want to take over, and the people are going to be tempted, in order to save their own life, to turn from God to serve other gods.

[9:36] And as Daniel sees this in his old age, you know, it's one of those moments that it's like, you know, Daniel, you could just be done. You could just, Cyrus has already sent Israelites back into the promised land.

[9:51] You could have just gone on home. Just forget all of this. Why are you still here? Well, he's still here because this is where God's had him, and he's still receiving message. And, and really the, the flavor of what is happening to God's people is what Paul talks about in Romans, where he talks about those who are sinners.

[10:10] And he says, although they know the ordinance of God, that those who practice such things are worthy of death, they not only do the same, but they also give hearty approval to those who practice them. Sin loves sin.

[10:24] People who sin love for others to join them in their sin. They want people to be a part of their sin. They give hearty approval to people who will live in sin.

[10:36] And sometimes the older you get, the more you just want to be kind of hidden away somewhere, away from the influences of the world, and not have to see it, not have to be in it, not have to feel the influence of it.

[10:49] And, and Daniel could have done that, but he didn't. And so as he's staying there in Persia, right, where other gods are worshiped, God gives him this other vision, this final vision to help him kind of pull back the curtain of what all this is really about, and, and what happens.

[11:11] And so we're going to start then by looking at the trouble for Daniel, and what he's going through. We see in verses one through three, that he is mourning and he's fasting.

[11:24] The exile is over. It's been over for about two years. He's mourning and, and fasting for three weeks, 21 days. Um, he didn't eat any tasty food, meat or wine, which kind of sounds like chapter one again, kind of bringing that back in.

[11:42] But in chapter one, he didn't do it so that he wouldn't defile himself. But now he's not eating it in order to pray to God so that God's people don't defile themselves. Um, in verse eight, it says that Daniel made up his mind that he would not defile himself with the king's choice food or the wine which he drank.

[12:01] So he sought permission from the commander not to do that. And so just, just making that, that connection. Um, it also says that he didn't put any oil on his head.

[12:11] That's basically the equivalence of having hygiene, right? So he's not taking a shower. He's not putting on any deodorant and he's not cleaning himself. So he's a nasty, he's a nasty man right now.

[12:22] Okay. He's so, he's so focused on the morning for what it is that's going on with God, people, with God's people confessing of sin that he, he rejects all of these things for the, for the three weeks.

[12:37] Um, he's also praying during the month of Passover. Um, and it's been 24 days, um, in the 24th day, you know, he's, he's been praying.

[12:51] And now the 24th day of that month, this guy comes and it, it, he comes and gives Daniel strength. But before I, before I get, I just want to say it's interesting because Daniel is so broken over the sin of the people that he goes through this himself of fasting and praying.

[13:13] Because he's just beseeching God for grace and mercy. For grace and mercy. And it's never wrong for us to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to, strength, and he particularly lacks strength before the divine. The divine shows up. In verse 8 of chapter 10, it says, so I was left alone and saw this great vision, yet no strength was left in me, for my color turned to a deathly paler, and I retained no strength. But I heard the sound of his words, and as soon as I heard the sound of his words, I fell into a deep sleep. You see him, he's got no strength. The color's removed from his face. He's got a deep sleep now. His face is on the ground. Then you get into verse 11. He says, I stood up trembling. So even though the guy tells him to stand up, he's still trembling. You can just see the effect of looking at the divine right there in front of him. In verses 15 through 17, he had spoken to me according to these words, and I turned my face toward the ground. So he's looking down. He's speechless. The one touched my mouth, and so I spoke. And then he says there at the end of verse 17, as for me, there remains just now no strength in me, nor any breath have been left in me. Here's kind of the image what you're getting.

[15:12] Daniel knows what he has seen before. He's thinking about the future. He's praying for God's people. He's fasting and praying for them, mourning over all of this. And when this guy shows up, it is so devastating to him that he loses all strength. So he's weak from fasting, and now he's made more weak because of the presence of this man in linen. The word anguish is the idea of pain.

[15:44] It's the idea of all of his strength being zapped out of him. He even says, how can I talk to you? Like, how can I talk to one such as you? Daniel's reaction gives us this glimpse that maybe this guy is something a little bit more than what we've seen in the others, because even though Daniel has a similar reaction, it's not quite as strong as it is in this one. But it is interesting, as we think about this, that Daniel's suffering comes from two places. All of this sin that he's seeing in God's people is weighing on him. And then when God's presence shows up, that becomes, it doesn't lift that weight. It presses it down more because of God's holiness. That's why.

[16:39] Because God, God in his presence, he is holy, he is righteous. And so it's, it's, any, any time someone in the Bible has encountered God, there has been a moment at which they have struggled to be in God's presence because God is holy. You can think about Moses at the burning bush. You can think about, um, uh, you can think about, uh, that's exactly the one I had just forgotten about. Isaiah chapter 6, he's in God's presence. And he says, woe is me. You can think about, think about Peter. Peter was fishing and Jesus comes up to the boat and says, cast your nets on the other side. And Peter's kind of like, what do you know, but does it anyway. And as he begins to haul in this massive amount of fish, he drops to his knees and says, go away from me, Lord, because he knows that Jesus is holy. So he wants to be away from that holiness. God's holy presence is not, it, it, it, it always brings to us a sense of woe, doom, and, uh, humility. And that's a good thing. That's the way it's supposed to work. Um, we, when we go to God in prayer, we definitely want to be affected by people's sin. We want to see that and it will not, not become callous to that, but also we really want to be in God's presence. We want to see his holiness because that helps to reframe our vision about everything.

[18:14] Um, so let's talk about this guy that comes up, the man in linen, this divine appearance. Some of the, tell me, tell me what are some of the, the descriptions of this guy? What are some of the things about him that, that are in the text? What is he like?

[18:33] Supernatural. Okay. What are some things about that make you say supernatural? Well, his eyes are like flaming torches. Eyes are like a flaming torches. Yeah. Face like lightning. Face like lightning. What is that? When you, when you think about the eyes, let's talk about the eyes first. When you see eyes that are flaming torches, what's, what's sort of the sense that that gives you about this person? I would say a sense of holiness, but.

[19:01] Okay. I don't know. You never, I've never seen anybody. Terrified. Terrified. Yeah. I mean, if your face is, face is lightning, I mean, what is that? You, you can't look at it. It's too bright. Maybe. Okay. So what else about him?

[19:17] Um, his voice like a multitude. Ooh. So, so that's interesting. That tumult, that word tumult, that usually that's with the idea of battle. So if you can imagine two huge armies that are clashing with each other, I don't know what that would sound like. I've seen a bunch of movies, like I watch Lord of the Rings, you know, so, so I know what that sounds like. No, I don't know what that sounds like, but, but this battle that's happening, you can, I can only imagine the screaming and the, the metal and the clanking and all this stuff. That's a big, huge noise. So that's what this is. It's like this huge crash happening, right? Okay. So every time he talks, every time this, this man in linen talks, that's what you get.

[20:04] Maybe that's just the best way you can describe it? Sure. Sure. Basically, I think it's this. Something he's never heard before, probably. Yeah, it's just massively loud and overbearing and, okay. What else about, about his features and things do you see? What's he wearing?

[20:27] He's wearing linen. He's wearing linen. That's right. And you know what the interesting thing about that word linen is? That linen, wherever you find it in the Old Testament, it's what the priests wear. So this person's coming dressed in priest clothing, even that gold belt that he's wearing. So the priest has the linen, but then he has a golden sash to hold it all together.

[21:02] Then he puts on the ephod. You know what the ephod is? The breastplate that's got the 12 stones in it. This guy doesn't have the ephod, but he's wearing the gold sash and the linen. So kind of a priestly look to him. I think that's about it. It talks about beryl, which is kind of like our modern topaz. That's kind of a similar sort of thing.

[21:24] Gold of a pad you use that. Yeah. So that's, that is a place. And if you've ever seen, and I don't really know anything about it because there's also connection to Ophir, the gold of Ophir. You can go back, I think it's Genesis chapter two that talks about the gold of Ophir. I don't know what this place is, but it's just the idea that it's, they knew what this was from. Okay.

[21:52] So the question is, is who is this guy? That's really the question. I wouldn't say it was, it's a incarnation of Christ, but then if you read further, it says that he was withheld by the Prince of Persians. I mean, could Christ really be withheld for, what did he say, three weeks or?

[22:11] Okay. That's a good question. 21 days. Mm-hmm. Anybody else want to take a stab? Could be an angel. Could be an angel. I mean, I think we're really only down to a couple choices, right?

[22:25] Like it's either an angel and a lot of people say it's Gabriel specifically because he was in chapter eight, but I don't think that's necessarily the truth because he's not named here and he was there. So why not name him? And then the other is Christ. So you think it's Christ? Okay. So now have I used the word before with you guys, uh, theophany, theophany?

[22:53] Yeah. Well, it's, yeah, it's kind of similar. So a theophany is an appearance of God in human form before the incarnation. And so for instance, uh, God walked in the garden, right? That's a theophany because it's a physical manifestation. The angel of the Lord in the burning bush was probably some sort of theophany as well. The commander of the army of the Lord that met with Joshua before Joshua took over Jericho. Um, the angel of the Lord that came to talk to Samson's parents before Samson was born. These are most likely theophanies of some kind.

[23:34] Um, so my view is that this is Christ. I think this is Christ. So let me tell you my reasons why. Oh, you want to ask me a question? Well, no, I just kind of read something that I thought maybe, maybe there's Christ here and Gabriel at the same time. Cause it says after on the first 10, it said, said suddenly a hand touched me and made me tremble to my knees. And then the man that touched him is speaking to him. And he said that, well, possibly if it's another man, he said that he was withheld for 21 days. So maybe they're both there. I I've heard, I've heard people say that because it seems like you've got one talking at the beginning, which maybe is Christ. And then maybe angel Gabriel comes in in the last part. I, but here's the thing. I'm not, I'm going to tell you what I think, but like you can just take that with a grain of salt, right? We're just trying to work through the text. I'll give you three reasons why I think it's Christ.

[24:31] Number one is because the description matches very closely to what we see of Christ in the book of revelation, right? There's a couple of similarities in the middle of the lampstand.

[24:42] I saw one like a son of man clothed in a robe, reaching to the feet, girded across his chest with a golden sash. His head and hair were white, like wool, like snow. Okay. So that would be some, some brightness there. His eyes were flame of fire. His feet were burnished bronze.

[25:01] When he had been made, when it had been made to glow in the furnace, his voice was like the sound of many waters, which is like a tumult. Now it gives us more information here than what we see in Daniel, but that kind of matches. Okay. So that's, that's a, that's a similarity.

[25:19] It doesn't stand on its own as, as, as, as, as, uh, as evidence. The second thing is that the effect of the presence of this man in linen is the effect of divine, holy presence and not just angel presence, right? So for instance, in chapter 10, verse seven, Daniel says, I alone saw the vision while the men who were with me did not see the vision. Nevertheless, a great dread fell on them and they ran away to hide themselves. So they don't even see the vision, but just the presence of the vision causes so much dread in them that they run away. Now that reminds me of a man in the new Testament who saw a vision of Jesus, but nobody else did. Who was that?

[26:14] Saul. That's right. And, and they, those men, it talks about how they were afraid because of the presence of God. And, and if you go to Isaiah six, you, we know that Isaiah saw the Lord and yet woe came upon him. And I would make the contention based on John chapter 12, that the Lord that he sees high upon the throne here is the pre-incarnate Christ. Because that's what John chapter 12 tells us is that Isaiah saw Christ seated upon the throne. So, so that's my second reason is that the presence of the divine gives off this, this effect basically of, of dread because of the holiness. And then my final reason is that in verse 16 and behold, one who resembled a human being. Now that's the NASB, but it's almost the exact same language as you have in chapter seven, where one like a son of man, one like a son of man. And this one who resembled a human or this one, like a, like the son of man, like a, like a man touched his lips. And, and so he's touched his lips the same way, uh, that Isaiah has his lips touched. Now there are the objections that you raise Rick, like, you know, why is it, um, um, that first of all, this one says he was sent with a message. That's verse 11, right? He was sent with a message. Um, but Jesus was too. I mean, you look into the new Testament and you can see Jesus talks about all the time. My father sent me, right? This is the reason my father sent me. So that's not a big deal. But then he says he needs help that he was fighting against the prince of Persia. And that's what delayed him. And then the angel Michael came to help him. But Jesus was helped in all kinds of ways in the new Testament, right? At the end of his, um, time of fasting after the devil tempted him, the angels came and ministered to him in the garden before his arrest, angels came to minister to Jesus.

[28:32] Jesus. So maybe that answers that, but again, it's not a hill for me to die on. I'm just giving you a possibility here. So also some, um, chapter nine, um, verse 23, he sees, uh, Gabriel and he says he, Gabriel refers to Daniel and is greatly beloved. And, uh, chapter nine. And then also he says it again, Gabriel. Yeah. Yeah. You know, I think, I think the big picture is this, that if it's Gabriel or another angel, or if it's Christ, the effect is, is that this one so represents God that we see such a, like an Isaiah experience where it's so overwhelmingly holy and scary. And this is the one who's going to talk to him. And so to me, it doesn't matter exactly, but I just think that even if it is Gabriel,

[29:33] Gabriel's obviously representing God and Christ and, and, and that, that kind of thing. He's referring to 16 and 17 is my Lord. That's why I think. Right. All of these little things that you see, I mean, you, you, I don't guess you really know, but that's what it seems like. That's right.

[29:55] That's right. I think it's one of those things. Take it, take a good guess, look at all the data and just hold it with your, with your fingers open, you know? I'm nervous. Is it said Lord capitalized on 16? Cause mine has a lower case.

[30:10] On 16 and 17? Uh, no, mine, no, it is lower case. So in English, the capitalization is going to be based upon the translators deciding what they think about it. So there's nothing in the Hebrew that would tell you if it's capitalized or not.

[30:34] Let's, let's move on to talk about the purpose of this guy, why this guy has come, this, this man in linen and verse 11 tells us that he's come to give comfort to Daniel. He says to Daniel, man of high esteem, understand the words that I'm about to tell you and stand upright for I have now been sent to you. And when he spoke these words to me, I stood up trembling. Daniel, he's telling him he's highly esteemed. Uh, I'm sure Daniel doesn't feel highly esteemed, but the Lord loves him and he wants him to know I'm here for you. Verse 12. Uh, then he said to me, do not be afraid, Daniel, for from the first day that you set your heart to understand this, and on humbling yourself before your God, your words were heard. And I've come in response to your words. So again, he's just coming to comfort Daniel. Don't be afraid. God has heard you. Here's the answer to what you have been praying for. This is what you need to know. You know, if this is Christ, if this is the pre-incarnate Christ, then here is the future Passover lamb coming at Passover to say, hey, I'm here for you, you know, and even if it's not Christ, but it's Gabriel, Gabriel's coming at the same time. And I think the message would be much the same. He's also come to give explanation of the delay. This is kind of an interesting passage, but the prince of the kingdom of Persia was withstanding me for 21 days. Now the word withstanding just means to oppose. So how, how, um, we don't really have a good image of what that means here. There's just some sort of opposition. Then behold, Michael, one of the chief princes came to help me for I had been left there with the kings of Persia. And I'm just going to tell you, there's a lot here that I don't get, but there's a couple of things we can say. I do believe that this prince of the kingdom of Persia is making reference to a angelic being, an evil angelic being, a demonic being, right?

[32:42] I believe that's what that is. And I think that for a couple of reasons, one, you've got Michael that's mentioned here in connection to this, but then you also have the idea, because you could say, well, wait a minute, who's the prince of the kingdom of Persia? Isn't that Cyrus?

[32:55] Cyrus? Except in chapter 11, verse one, the same man in Lennon says, in the first year of Darius or Cyrus, I arose to be an encouragement and protection for him. So how could he be a protection for him here?

[33:15] But now I've been fighting him for 21 days. So I don't think the man in Lennon is telling us that he, as a spiritual being, was having a 21-day fight with a physical being.

[33:29] I just think this is all spiritual, okay? So that obviously brings up lots of questions. One of those is a lot of people will say things like that there are territorial spirits.

[33:43] That is, that there are demonic spirits that live in certain places on the globe. So I'm not so sure that we can really say much about that at all. I don't think it's so much territorial as it is behind the scenes, if you will. And we'll, we'll come back to that here in just a second. So, so, so basically the man has come to say to Daniel, here's why the delay, the delay is because there are spiritual forces of wickedness behind things that are going on. And that's why the delay in coming to you to give you the answer to what you're praying for. Uh, he's also come to give strength to Daniel. We see that in verse 10, he touched him. And even though he is trembling on his hands and knees, he was laying on his face. Verse 16, he's touched his lips and now given him strength to speak. And then he touches him again, verse 18, and it strengthens him. Okay. So there we have Daniel's trouble. We've got this divine appearance. Now we need to look at the message. What is, what's the message that he's being told from, from God? So here's, what's interesting. Verse one, it uses the same word over and over again. It says in the third year of King Cyrus of Persia, a message was revealed to Daniel who was named Belteshazzar. And the message was true and one of great conflict, but he understood the message and had an understanding of the vision. That word message is used three times.

[35:20] Um, and it's this word, it's this, um, it's this, this vision. And he talks about it being true, talks about it being a great conflict and that Daniel understood it. Um, you're going to see again, as you get to the end of, um, chapter 11, that, and I think even 12, that this idea of this message of truth or the, no, it was at the end of chapter 10, there's this, this writing of truth or this scroll of truth. So here's, here's the image. Daniel's praying. And as he does, there's a vision, if you will, of writing of truth or a message of truth, a word of truth, a scroll of truth.

[36:10] And it's this scroll that he's going to be told to seal up in chapter 12, that this man in linen is coming to tell him about, uh, and this, this thing is true and it's of great conflict. And that's, that's what we need to think about with these, this prince of the kingdom of Persia, the prince of the kingdom of Greece, these demonic forces behind things. He's saying there's a great conflict and, and behind the physical conflict that's going on is the unseen spirit realm where there's conflict going on. Here's what's going to happen. Chapter 11, when you read chapter 11, you're going to see the King of the North, the King of the South, the King of the North, the King of the South, the King of the North, the King of the South. And you're going to see war, betrayal, marriage, feasts, betrayal, war, killing. Like it is a huge long chapter that like, it's almost hard to read it and not get completely and entirely lost because it's just back and forth to the King of the North, the King of the South, the King of the North. And it's describing what happens in history with real people. But before he gets to that, he's telling Daniel behind all of this, there is this unseen world of these demonic forces that are at work in the kingdom of Persia, in the kingdom of Greece, that, that not, not in a cabal sort of conspiracy theory way of working things, but just in the sense that people are influenced by the world, the devil and their sin and sin. And so it's much like what

[37:55] Paul talks about in Ephesians chapter six, that says that our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the powers, against the world forces of this darkness, against the spiritual forces of wickedness in the heavenly places. So, so in other words, it's not Cyrus and the Persians that are the primary enemy of God's people, but it's the demonic forces behind that. It's the devil and all of all those that he has dragged with him. It's not Nebuchadnezzar as the world power, but it's the principalities and powers behind the throne that are influencing him.

[38:34] God wanted Daniel to know, and therefore the people of God to live with a balanced understanding of the way the world works. Even in our own governments around the world, that spiritual battle is happening behind the scenes. You know, we, we do what we can to, to take the word of God to our neighbors.

[38:58] It's like the guy, you know, who's out on the beach, all the starfish are on the beach and he picks up a starfish and throws it in the water, but it's covered with millions of starfish. And somebody says, what?

[39:09] That doesn't matter. You're not making a difference. He says, well, it matters to that one, right? Well, as we disciple people, we're just kind of taking one at a time and chunking them back into the water. But when we get involved and making sure that we're praying for the governing authorities, making sure that we're involved in the political process, voting, casting our vote, holding politicians accountable, even maybe running for office ourselves and taking our Christian principles with us into that, that's when we're kind of taking the fight to the spiritual forces in that way.

[39:42] But, but the, God's people needed to understand that it's, it's not what you just see on the outside. That is the, the total picture. These people coming back and forth through Jerusalem, bringing war, bringing havoc, bringing idolatry. There are spiritual forces behind it. And if you're not aware of that, you won't have a balanced view of this life. You can't blame every little thing on a demon. And so you can't go that far with it and be unbalanced that way. But you also can't say there's nothing out there and go too far that way. Daniel and the people of God, for them, this knowledge would help them to be prepared and ready and not get caught off guard believing the wrong things about this world. There is an unseen world. There is a battle. And it happens even in our own lives. You think about what happens with your kids, what happens with our grandkids. We see them struggling with sin and addiction and temptation. And that's not just bald badness in them. That's also a spiritual battle that's going on. And how do we face it? Well, we face it as Daniel was facing it through prayer, through leaning upon the word, through, you know, trusting in God and bringing in other godly people to be a part of that. It can happen in marriage. It can happen in parenting. It can happen in the church. And so we've got to take up what Paul talks about as the spiritual weapons and use those.

[41:24] So I think that's what this guy coming in, kind of getting ready to tell us all this about the vision is doing with this chapter is kind of like there's, I'm going to tell you about the battle.

[41:36] I'm going to tell you about the future. But before I get there, just know there's a spiritual war behind all this. So anyway, that's chapter 10. That's fun.

[41:48] So, you know, there's a spiritual war, a spiritual battle, but I mean, all this was already predetermined.

[41:59] God told Daniel what would happen. So even though there's that war, God still knows the exact outcome of the future. I mean, I know we don't know what's happening in heaven, but it's kind of hard to fathom.

[42:16] Is everything predetermined? It's kind of just kind of one thing I think about sometimes. Yeah. Like our country, is it predetermined what's going to happen in our country 10 years from now?

[42:28] Or can we change things around? I mean, it's hard to. Yeah. So, so I would say yes.

[42:40] Right. And the reason I. Predetermined or that you change. Predetermined. No, I think so. And, and here's the thing. It's predetermined all the way down to even God, God has chosen to use even our prayers. Right. So, so, so in other words, fate, fate, which is not a Christian idea says that whatever's going to happen is going to happen no matter what we do. And so you can see in Greek mythology, you can see these people trying to run from their fate and they go running off this direction. Yet they end up right there where they were trying to go away from. Well, that's not the way God works. God, yes, has predetermined things, but he's predetermined it in, in such a way that we fall right in line. We want that same thing, you know? So, so as God's wanting to save our children and we say, we look at our children, we want them saved. We pray for them. We pray for them. We pray for them and we share the gospel with them and we stay after them and we don't, we don't let it go. Why is that?

[43:40] Because that's what God's going to use to bring about what it is that he wants to bring about. And so with this country, what does he want to bring about in this country? Like if, does he want this country to end? Well, he hasn't told any of us, but we find ourselves in a place calling on Christians to say, Hey, are we going to stand up in prayer? Are we going to make a difference in this world? And if a vast majority of Christians begin to revive and begin to pray and begin to make changes and begin to hold the moral line and all these kinds of things, then what you have is you have to have an example of like, okay, look, there's, there's perhaps maybe an inkling of what it is that God wanted because look what he's using and what's, what's happening. And so, so while I do say yes, I also say that every decision we make is absolutely important.

[44:26] Sure it is. And you got, you got to really assume that God is in charge of everything or he's not in charge of anything. That's right. It's all or nothing. That's right. And that's hard to do. But like you say, there's that, you know, there's that thing that we can intercede ourselves to help shape and I guess be in tune with what comes down the line, I guess.

[44:53] Yeah. Yeah. That's good. That's good. That God is sovereign over everything, but he still has free will. That's kind of a hard concept. So, so I would say, I would, I would just say it as the, as the idea that like Spurgeon, Spurgeon used to talk about it like this way with people's salvation.

[45:15] You know, it's like he said, as you walk up to the gates of heaven, it will say, you know, uh, whoever, whoever will may come. And so as you go through the gates of heaven and then you turn around, look back, it says chosen from the foundation of the world.

[45:30] Yeah. And so how, how does, how is it that God predetermines everything that happens yet? We have free choice to be able to make. And it's like, the answer is, I don't know. I don't know.

[45:41] And I think that if we could explain it, then it would somewhat explain away God and the mechanics of it. And I just don't think we can get there. Right. I think all the predestination stuff that people preach or you agree with it or disagree with it.

[45:57] But I think what that really all that is, is that God already knows who is going to accept him and who is not. I think that. Mm-hmm. I don't know. How plausible is that?

[46:09] Yeah. Well, I mean, he, uh, if, if, if he is, has no end and no beginning and he's infinite, then, and he's all knowing and he's unlimited in all of his knowledge, I mean, then, yeah, he knows everything.

[46:28] He knows everything. I guess, you know, time moves a direction and then he gives us a chance to opt in or, or to opt out. Yeah. I mean, You get your in or your out and it kind of goes like that?

[46:40] And, again, I, I just keep coming back to definition because, because I feel like sometimes we try to peek behind the veil. And when we do, you know, it's like, it's like walking into the Holy of Holies, you know, no one's supposed to do that.

[46:52] Because if you do, you just die. Right. But, but like it's, it's, he's determined everything that comes to pass and yet we, every choice we make is important. And so that it's like trying to explain the Trinity.

[47:04] I really can't, but I can define it. And I feel like that's the best definition of these things. And, uh, I feel like it brings us great comfort. It's like, so God knows everything and God's planned everything.

[47:16] And so nothing happens to me by accident. And so it has a good reason. And he's, he's with me in it. He, he, he determined that before it ever happened, before I was born.

[47:27] And so he, the comfort to me that that brings is great because it means that it's, it's not brought about by evil demons. It's not brought about by, by happenstance and chance and random.

[47:39] Therefore, it means something. God's using it to accomplish something. Because if it's not God, then it's just either random or demons in it for that. Then it didn't mean nothing.

[47:50] And so, um, yeah, it's a hard, it's a hard pill for some people to swallow to try to say both of those things. But both of those things are true. Always.

[48:01] It's pictures for both of us. That's right. I always go back to Psalm 139 and 16. Your eyes have seen my unformed substance. In your book, it's written, all the days that were our name for me.

[48:12] When is he out there without one? That's right. You know, God's pretty much in charge. That's right. Same Psalm says that before a word is on my lips, you know it. You know every one of them.

[48:23] Yeah.